Which of the 2012-16 Orioles would you put in the Orioles HOF?

[webbrick2010]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Did we miss the playoffs because of his good years?  Did we make the playoffs because of his horrible years?  If his horrible year was 2014 where we had a legit shot to make the WS, was not making the WS his fault because of his horrible year?

Is it his fault that he signed a franchise destroying contract?  Who offered it to him?

So I assume you are voting him to the Orioles HOF?

Unless you are just arguing to be combative?

It is his fault/responsibility/failure that he posted the worst season in baseball history. Sure put him in the O's HOF. The franchise can't be much more of a joke.

[Moose Milligan]

14 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

So I assume you are voting him to the Orioles HOF?

Unless you are just arguing to be combative?

It is his fault/responsibility/failure that he posted the worst season in baseball history. Sure put him in the O's HOF. The franchise can't be much more of a joke.

Did you not want to answer any of my questions, rhetorical as they were?

The title of the thread is 2012-2016, we're taking into consideration a specific window.  I didn't say I'm voting for him, but I think he's got a case.  This thread is an interesting exercise in "what have you done for me lately."  Davis sucks, for sure.  I want him gone.  Tillman was also disaster at the end but 2012-2016 doesn't happen without him and people want to overlook him?   I'm not going to throw out Davis' good years because he's been terrible recently.  Is he clearly an O's HoF?  Debatable.  I'd probably lean towards not voting for him after thinking about it a little more but there's a case to be made.  

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

Bordick had the unenviable task of being the guy who they acquired to move Cal from SS to 3B.   I remember reading the WaPo article about it, sitting on the back steps of my high school and doing my best to not flip my $#*%.  If you think 37 year old Moose Milligan is bad, you should have seen the 1996 offseason version.  

And while Bordick's stat sheet here certainly doesn't warrant an Orioles HoF nod, he was a solid player and I ended up really liking him.  I mean, way, way better than Manny Alexander.  Remember when Manny Alexander was the heir apparent?  F that guy. 

My point is that Bordick had a really, really hard job when he got here.  And it's not like they sent Cal packing, either.  No, the living legend that he had to replace was standing 30 feet to his right the whole time.  Bordick handled it with class and grace, was a good defender  (don't whip out advanced stats on me, let me have my memories) and wasn't a complete liability with his bat.  So while the stats don't add up to being an O's HoFer, I think a lot of his induction has to do with how he handled a sticky situation.  IMO, that's one of the things that a teams HoF is for, guys that might not have dazzling stats but mean something to a fanbase or a community.  

FYI, the advanced stats completely support your memory that he was a good defender.    He had an Rtot of +50 as an Oriole, and in my opinion, should have won the Gold Glove twice, in 1999 and 2002.    To me, he’s far from the worst guy in the Orioles HOF.

[Moose Milligan]

2 minutes ago, Frobby said:

FYI, the advanced stats completely support your memory that he was a good defender.    He had an Rtot of +50 as an Oriole, and in my opinion, should have won the Gold Glove twice, in 1999 and 2002.    To me, he’s far from the worst guy in the Orioles HOF.

I'm cool with advanced stats reinforcing my memories, not disagreeing with them.  Like many, I'm only interested in information that agrees with me  

[Beef Supreme]

I looked at it through the lens of which players are amongst the best at their position. Britton, Hardy, Jones, Machado, Markakis, Schoop and Wieters are all among the best Orioles at their positions. Tillman and O'Day had success but i don't view them amongst the franchise's all-time best. Despite a few tremendously successful seasons, Davis -- who is nearly as infamous as he is famous -- doesn't rank as one of the Orioles' best at first base (some good competition there). 

[Frobby]

So, the count so far reveals a clear cut top 5 — Adam, Nick, Manny, JJ and Zach.   All those seem to have been chosen by at least 55-60% of the total voters, while the others are all less than 25%.     I think your answer depends a bit on whether you were comparing these players to those already in the Orioles HOF, or setting a higher bar.

[Enjoy Terror]

58 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I think your answer depends a bit on whether you were comparing these players to those already in the Orioles HOF, or setting a higher bar.

I personally think a higher bar should be set. I’m fine with Hardy levels of contribution being that bar.

Looking at it now, I’d be okay with anyone with career double-digit fWAR being in the Orioles Hall. That would be 41 position players and 23 pitchers.

This would, however, include Gausman, Guthrie, and Rodrigo Lopez, but not Chen. Schoop also misses the cut, but Davis is in. There wouldn’t be any of the famous closers we’ve come to know over the last 35 years either.

EDIT: also surprised that Wieters did more damage as an Oriole than Tejada did.

[Moose Milligan]

You guys are smoking crack if you're not voting for Wieters.  And I wasn't even a huge Wieters fan.  Yeah, he never lived up to the "Mauer with power" thing but that shouldn't matter.  4 time all-star, 2 time gold glover.  

[atomic]

3 hours ago, Enjoy Terror said:

I personally think a higher bar should be set. I’m fine with Hardy levels of contribution being that bar.

Looking at it now, I’d be okay with anyone with career double-digit fWAR being in the Orioles Hall. That would be 41 position players and 23 pitchers.

This would, however, include Gausman, Guthrie, and Rodrigo Lopez, but not Chen. Schoop also misses the cut, but Davis is in. There wouldn’t be any of the famous closers we’ve come to know over the last 35 years either.

EDIT: also surprised that Wieters did more damage as an Oriole than Tejada did.

Davis might have less than double digit career WAR in a few years.

[atomic]

I don't get these results.  Did people think they could only vote for one player?  Did they miss the word Orioles and think it was for mlb hall of fame.  AJ is a sure thing first ballot 100 percent of the vote  and he has only 23 percent of the vote.  Buck is a sure thing as well.  

[OriolesMagic83]

41 minutes ago, atomic said:

I don't get these results.  Did people think they could only vote for one player?  Did they miss the word Orioles and think it was for mlb hall of fame.  AJ is a sure thing first ballot 100 percent of the vote  and he has only 23 percent of the vote.  Buck is a sure thing as well.  

I don't think the poll worked the way it was intended.  It calculated the percentage of total votes that a player received, not the percentage of voters that voted for a player.  77 of 81 voters voted for Jones which is close to 95%, but he only received 23% of the total votes, because people voted for other players.

[atomic]

28 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I don't think the poll worked the way it was intended.  It calculated the percentage of total votes that a player received, not the percentage of voters that voted for a player.  77 of 81 voters voted for Jones which is close to 95%, but he only received 23% of the total votes, because people voted for other players.

Oh then the results make a lot more sense.