Embarrassing day for the O's

[weams]

29 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Players have to do both.  The decision of who plays will be based on the whole package not just one element.

No they don't. Plenty of great players had a stronger defense or offense. Sometimes it's not the most well rounded guy. 

[Redskins Rick]

1 minute ago, weams said:

Embarrassing? What did you think would happen with this group of minor leaguers and washed up veterans? Really. What I saw were a few final camp battles, Bundy being able to throw 72 pitches. And a couple guys cooling off of what has been unrealistic expectations. I saw a feel good story reliever give it up. 

Its all perspective and if you are a doom and gloomer. Some posters wasnt happy when the team was in that five year window of winning, and they thought the sky was falling then.

[weams]

52 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Me too.  The ones who hit and can play defense.

Or might have the best pedigree, or the best chance at being a piece for the future or having a specific tool that those in charge feel can be developed. Again, not the best at all things. Or the speediest. Or the flashiest defender.

[wildcard]

2 minutes ago, weams said:

No they don't. Plenty of great players had a stronger defense or offense. Sometimes it;s not the most well rounded guy. 

Really?  

[interloper]

1 minute ago, weams said:

No they don't. Plenty of great players had a stronger defense or offense. Sometimes it;s not the most well rounded guy. 

Cesar Izturis played 13 years. 

[weams]

Just now, Redskins Rick said:

Its all perspective and if you are a doom and gloomer. Some posters wasnt happy when the team was in that five year window of winning, and they thought the sky was falling then.

I loved every moment of the winning window. 

[weams]

1 minute ago, interloper said:

Cesar Izturis played 13 years. 

Exactly. Some folks thought Adam Dunn was good.  Ted Williams was great. 

[interloper]

If a guy like Mullins is not "great", he will at least be "useful". That's not nothing! We had to draft Joey Rickard to find a useful 4th outfielder. These guys don't just grow on trees like it may seem. And Mullins is far and away a better defender than a guy like Rickard. And a better runner. And probably a better hitter (at least more upside/pop)!

[weams]

4 minutes ago, interloper said:

If a guy like Mullins is not "great", he will at least be "useful". That's not nothing! We had to draft Joey Rickard to find a useful 4th outfielder. These guys don't just grow on trees like it may seem. And Mullins is far and away a better defender than a guy like Rickard. And a better runner. And probably a better hitter!

I don't think they are thinking of cutting him. Not from the organization. This regime does not appear to be wedded to the "Cedric takes over for Adam" narrative.  His arm is awful . He looked bad in left field too. I know he has cover speed and leaping ability. I like that on him. But he has yet to show much offense and the defense could certainly be replaced. 

[interloper]

Just now, weams said:

I don't think they are thinking of cutting him. Not from the organization. This regime does not appear to be wedded to the "Cedric takes over for Adam" narrative.  His arm is awful . He looked bad in left field too. I know he has cover speed and leaping ability. I like that on him. But he has yet to show much offense and the defense could certainly be replaced. 

McKenna can/will definitely challenge, for sure. Mullins has to hit a little to be a starting outfielder, but I still think he's got 4th guy value. 

[interloper]

By the way, there is room on the OD roster for all of the following:

Mancini
Hays
Mullins
Rickard
One of Santander/Young Jr/Smith Jr

[UpstateNYfan]

On purely defensive terms...no mention of offense. Which is more important, arm strength or the ability to take away a base, an extra base or a hit because speed and the ability to read the ball off the bat. To me it seems the outfielder has more impact on getting to the ball, than his arm. I recall remarks that Mark Balanger was a .300 plus hitter if you added the hits he took away from the opposition every year to his BA. I also recall a guy name Horace Clark on the Yankees was described as "drives in 3 runs, lets in 4" due do his defensive liabilities. You have to believe that the O's pitchers last years ERA's were impacted by the extraordinary defensively poor team behind them. If this team can save a run or two each game by D, and pitchers (Bundy) can learn to keep the ball in the park, I think less than 100 loses are possible.

[Redskins Rick]

48 minutes ago, weams said:

I loved every moment of the winning window. 

Me too, and coming after 14 years of losing, was very welcomed.

[LookinUp]

2 hours ago, Enjoy Terror said:

Dumb question about defense... I expect the answer to be “no” but somehow on the Internet there’s always someone to tell me otherwise:

Obviously pitching and hitting is more difficult the higher the league you’re in, but does defense change? Like, is playing centerfield in the MLB harder than AAA? 

Assuming all parks are equal, that is.

It's not a dumb question. Defense, in the aggregate, is harder the higher you go. On any given play, it will vary. 

The biggest difference is the quality of your opponents. MLB lineups can punish you from the top to the bottom of most orders. Even guys who hit .230 in the majors were usually the studs on teams before the majors. That means the mistakes get magnified. You can get away with an error or an extra base against a team with two good hitters and a bunch of scrubs around them like most high school teams. It's much less forgiving in the majors, and thus more pressure exists.

The other difference is the athleticism of the opponent. The average home to first speed (or time to any base in any situation) will be faster in the majors because you're playing, on average, the best athletes. That's not to say that the routine grounder to first by the high school running back isn't just as hard of an individual play to make, but you run into that scenario much more often as you move up the in competition.

[LookinUp]

By the way, after reading this thread, I think there's a solid chance that Mullins is demoted. Santander seems to have earned a spot. Hays is forcing his way onto the team. We just traded for Smith, so I think his chances are actually good. I assume they'll keep Rickard over Mullins, but that's just my guess.