Getting the roster from 27 to 38

[HowAboutThat]

21 minutes ago, interloper said:

But there's a reason and a calculus, so to speak, for any move. 

I agree that there was a reason, but as I said before, unless he was going extremely deep into his peripherals, that reason was illogical. It seems to me that the first rule of dumping a guy is, “don’t dump a guy if he’s better than other guys you could dump more easily.”

So don’t dump Ellis while you still have Mattson, for instance.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

I don’t see a catcher getting a MLB deal. 
 

I also see them leaving atleast 3 spots open for the Rule 5 draft. However…The CBA ends before the draft, so…

[Jammer7]

31 minutes ago, Legend_Of_Joey said:

I don’t see a catcher getting a MLB deal. 
 

I also see them leaving atleast 3 spots open for the Rule 5 draft. However…The CBA ends before the draft, so…

You may be right, hard to tell. I could see them signing a proven MLB veteran catcher to begin the season as the starter and move Adley up in May to become the primary guy and understudy the veteran guy. Maybe a Sandy Leon or Kurt Suzuki type. 

[Jammer7]

2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

I guess you protect Smith but I would have rather kept Ellis and Harvey over him.

Smith pitched very well, lights out, in AA, not so much in AAA. So, he isn’t an automatic protect for me unless there was some negligence or malfunction on the part of departed coach Kennie Steenstra or manager Gary Kendall. I understand the push back on Smith, but I think the upside is worth protecting this year. 

As far as Chris Ellis, at first glance I was a little surprised, but not too much when you look at the peripherals. A fly ball pitcher, not a high k-rate, his babip was a lucky low .228 with us, the FIP was 4.57 and the xFIP was 5.4. I know the ERA was 2.15, but that was really deceiving in a small sample. I would bet his metrics on spin and effective spin are not great either.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/chris-ellis/16125/stats?position=P

[Jammer7]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Yea, there was also stupidity involved.

27 other stupid teams too, I guess. The Giants are probably going to try to pass him through waivers and outright him to AAA to see if he is salvageable. I do not get the venom, Rob. They stuck by him for a long time. Time to cut bait. It’s a business. If he comes back and proves they were wrong, then they deserve the criticism. But no sense keeping cheap and broken talent when it brings no value, at all.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

1 hour ago, Jammer7 said:

You may be right, hard to tell. I could see them signing a proven MLB veteran catcher to begin the season as the starter and move Adley up in May to become the primary guy and understudy the veteran guy. Maybe a Sandy Leon or Kurt Suzuki type. 

Eh…In my opinion, it depends on the CBA.

If “service time” stuff gets taken out, I think the only catchers they sign are whoever takes an MiLB deal and puts them in a battle to be Adley’s backup.

If service time still means something, then I could see them signing someone to a MLB deal, which gives them more options.

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, Jammer7 said:

27 other stupid teams too, I guess. The Giants are probably going to try to pass him through waivers and outright him to AAA to see if he is salvageable. I do not get the venom, Rob. They stuck by him for a long time. Time to cut bait. It’s a business. If he comes back and proves they were wrong, then they deserve the criticism. But no sense keeping cheap and broken talent when it brings no value, at all.

There is no reason to cut bait until you have to.  The Orioles didn’t have to.  
 

When better and/or higher upside options are introduced, I’m ok with these decisions.  

Those ideas haven’t been introduced yet.

You had, at minimum, another 3 guys you cut before him and perhaps as many as 7 or 8.  Harvey shouldn’t have even been a discussion at this point, much less make the move.

[gold21030]

3 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

I'd be OK with getting rid of Lopez. Don't get the fascination at all. 

He's got solid stuff and has shown success the first time through a lineup. No reason to let him go without seeing if he can be an effective reliever. Especially when this team is desperate for bullpen arms.

[wildcard]

5 hours ago, Jammer7 said:

27 other stupid teams too, I guess. The Giants are probably going to try to pass him through waivers and outright him to AAA to see if he is salvageable. I do not get the venom, Rob. They stuck by him for a long time. Time to cut bait. It’s a business. If he comes back and proves they were wrong, then they deserve the criticism. But no sense keeping cheap and broken talent when it brings no value, at all.

Hunter still has a option left.

[wildcard]

4 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

There is no reason to cut bait until you have to.  The Orioles didn’t have to.  
 

When better and/or higher upside options are introduced, I’m ok with these decisions.  

Those ideas haven’t been introduced yet.

You had, at minimum, another 3 guys you cut before him and perhaps as many as 7 or 8.  Harvey shouldn’t have even been a discussion at this point, much less make the move.

To me cutting Hunter is an indication the Elias expects to make a lot of moves this off season.

[Jammer7]

4 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

There is no reason to cut bait until you have to.  The Orioles didn’t have to.  
 

When better and/or higher upside options are introduced, I’m ok with these decisions.  

Those ideas haven’t been introduced yet.

You had, at minimum, another 3 guys you cut before him and perhaps as many as 7 or 8.  Harvey shouldn’t have even been a discussion at this point, much less make the move.

I think several others will be cut, certainly. The timing was meant to try to get him through, and it nearly worked. I don’t think he is the same guy he once was, stuff wise. He may never be again. I have heard things from people I know that suggest he had poor preparation. It’s heresay, but that many injuries seems to corroborate. IDK.

Sometimes you have to add by subtraction. Change the culture. I’ve been an advocate on this move for months. He was zero value for us since 2019. 

[Jammer7]

26 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Hunter still has a option left.

Yeah, I know. But if no other team took him, and they picked at the end, then why not sneak him through? Why waste a 40 man slot?

[Sports Guy]

21 minutes ago, Jammer7 said:

I think several others will be cut, certainly. The timing was meant to try to get him through, and it nearly worked. I don’t think he is the same guy he once was, stuff wise. He may never be again. I have heard things from people I know that suggest he had poor preparation. It’s heresay, but that many injuries seems to corroborate. IDK.

Sometimes you have to add by subtraction. Change the culture. I’ve been an advocate on this move for months. He was zero value for us since 2019. 

I’m guessing that getting rid of Harvey isn’t changing the culture in any way.

[UMDTerrapins]

6 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I’m guessing that getting rid of Harvey isn’t changing the culture in any way.

They could plant a rumor among the organization’s minor leaguers that it was a “mullet thing”. 

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, UMDTerrapins said:

They could plant a rumor among the organization’s minor leaguers that it was a “mullet thing”. 

Kentucky waterfalls are always great for morale.