O's looking for RH 1B

[JTrea81]

He's been mentioned before, most people don't like his bat. Personally I think he's one of the better affordable non-free agent options.

MacPhail has already said he's going to the FA market to fill all the holes before turning to trades...

[TonySoprano]

MacPhail has already said he's going to the FA market to fill all the holes before turning to trades...

So now you believe the guy who didn't dip into Angelos' "wide-open vault" when it counted?

[El Gordo]

Maybe we can sign Griffey to play 1B. He used to be a great CF so he'd be a natural at 1B.:rolleyestf:

[ugen64]

Maybe we can sign Griffey to play 1B. He used to be a great CF so he'd be a natural at 1B.:rolleyestf:

Look, I know you're being sarcastic, but you're completely missing the point. If you add up Griffey's UZR/150 over the past 4 seasons in CF, you end up with a number like -25. He's one of the worst defensive CF in all of baseball right now. Baldelli, meanwhile, would be in the middle of the pack if he could just stay healthy.

[El Gordo]

Look, I know you're being sarcastic, but you're completely missing the point. If you add up Griffey's UZR/150 over the past 4 seasons in CF, you end up with a number like -25. He's one of the worst defensive CF in all of baseball right now. Baldelli, meanwhile, would be in the middle of the pack if he could just stay healthy.

I said he used to be a great CF. And I see no correlation between the ability to play CF and the ability to play 1B. Certainly not like the ability to play 3B and the ability to play 1B.

[trueoriolesfan]

What about Nick Swisher? The Baltimore Sun Article said " the Orioles are still in the market for a first baseman, specifically a right-handed hitter or switch-hitter " Swisher is a switch-hitter. He can play 1st and all three Outfield postions. I don't know what the Yanks are asking for though. He would be a great fit here.

[ugen64]

I said he used to be a great CF. And I see no correlation between the ability to play CF and the ability to play 1B. Certainly not like the ability to play 3B and the ability to play 1B.

The correlation is purely subjective. I don't think it's that much of a reach to say "if you're athletic enough to play CF at an average level, you're probably athletic enough to play 1B at an above average level". Seriously - Ryan Howard is an "average" 1B according to UZR/150. I kind of think Baldelli would be a better first baseman than Ryan Howard, even though Howard has a lot more experience at the position.

[Why Not?]

I said he used to be a great CF. And I see no correlation between the ability to play CF and the ability to play 1B. Certainly not like the ability to play 3B and the ability to play 1B.

Though it might not seem to make sense, it actually DOES work that way. The sad fact is that an elite defensive 1B like a Mattingly or Pujols would probably make a crappy SS while Ozzie Smith or Bill Mazeroski would probably make an elite 1B. Years of studies of players making position changes bears this out.

[El Gordo]

Though it might not seem to make sense, it actually DOES work that way. The sad fact is that an elite defensive 1B like a Mattingly or Pujols would probably make a crappy SS while Ozzie Smith or Bill Mazeroski would probably make an elite 1B. Years of studies of players making position changes bears this out.

Yes but we are talking about OF. Did you ever play baseball? I played 3b, 1B and RF. RF was a lot less demanding then 3B. There's a big difference between shaging flyballs and fielding hard hit GB's. An OF's ability is dependent on his speed and ability to read flyballs of the bat and get good jumps. It has nothing to do with the foot work and glove work that 1B requires. And an OF doesn't have to consider nearly as many game situations as a 1B. Just being athletic doesn't mean you can keep you head in the game and do the things that are necessary to play 1B. Youkalis, not a duffer at either 1B or 3B, has said 1B is more difficult. That would be my experience too.

[33rdst]

Yes but we are talking about OF. Did you ever play baseball? I played 3b, 1B and RF. RF was a lot less demanding then 3B. There's a big difference between shaging flyballs and fielding hard hit GB's. An OF's ability is dependent on his speed and ability to read flyballs of the bat and get good jumps. It has nothing to do with the foot work and glove work that 1B requires. And an OF doesn't have to consider nearly as many game situations as a 1B. Just being athletic doesn't mean you can keep you head in the game and do the things that are necessary to play 1B. Youkalis, not a duffer at either 1B or 3B, has said 1B is more difficult. That would be my experience too.

Oh good we'll just forget about teaching those kids about drop steps and crow hops.

[Why Not?]

Yes but we are talking about OF. Did you ever play baseball? I played 3b, 1B and RF. RF was a lot less demanding then 3B. There's a big difference between shaging flyballs and fielding hard hit GB's. An OF's ability is dependent on his speed and ability to read flyballs of the bat and get good jumps. It has nothing to do with the foot work and glove work that 1B requires. And an OF doesn't have to consider nearly as many game situations as a 1B. Just being athletic doesn't mean you can keep you head in the game and do the things that are necessary to play 1B. Youkalis, not a duffer at either 1B or 3B, has said 1B is more difficult. That would be my experience too.

That's all correct, but it doesn't change baseball history. Players regularly move down the spectrum with success (including OF to 1B) and rarely move up the spectrum with success. Obviously that doesn't mean every good defensive player will play decently at 1B, but the odds are outstanding.

[El Gordo]

That's all correct, but it doesn't change baseball history. Players regularly move down the spectrum with success (including OF to 1B) and rarely move up the spectrum with success. Obviously that doesn't mean every good defensive player will play decently at 1B, but the odds are outstanding.

Did they make the transition in one ST? Got any numbers on that? 1B has traditionally been the repository for aging power hitters who used to be OF mostly. But know we have DH for that and defense is more important these days. A good defensive 1B can do wonders to mprove IF play which can do wonders to improve your SP. You are much more likely for this to happen if you move your 3B to 1B than if you move your CF to 1B. If this were the case why haven't Griffey, Edmonds, and any number of other aging CF been playing 1B the past few years? How much 1B did Bernie play. Of the 10 great CF only Mantle played any significant number of games at 1B his last two seasons.

[DrungoHazewood]

Yes but we are talking about OF. Did you ever play baseball? I played 3b, 1B and RF. RF was a lot less demanding then 3B. There's a big difference between shaging flyballs and fielding hard hit GB's. An OF's ability is dependent on his speed and ability to read flyballs of the bat and get good jumps. It has nothing to do with the foot work and glove work that 1B requires. And an OF doesn't have to consider nearly as many game situations as a 1B. Just being athletic doesn't mean you can keep you head in the game and do the things that are necessary to play 1B. Youkalis, not a duffer at either 1B or 3B, has said 1B is more difficult. That would be my experience too.

No matter how hard a position appears to be, teams value defense at third over defense at first. And they value defense in right field about equally with defense at third. Throughout history old (and even not so old) outfielders and third basemen have regularly moved to first. Almost no players have lost a step at first and moved to third or the outfield. Jason Giambi and Mark McGwire started out as third basemen. Very quickly they were moved to first when it was obvious they didn't have the defensive chops. I could name examples like that all day long.

Offensive production bears this out, too. When a team needs to get a bat in the lineup, they put the guy at first (or DH). They rarely put a glove-first guy at first base and the Dick Stuart clone at third. It's almost always the other way around.

[ugen64]

Did they make the transition in one ST? Got any numbers on that? 1B has traditionally been the repository for aging power hitters who used to be OF mostly. But know we have DH for that and defense is more important these days. A good defensive 1B can do wonders to mprove IF play which can do wonders to improve your SP. You are much more likely for this to happen if you move your 3B to 1B than if you move your CF to 1B. If this were the case why haven't Griffey, Edmonds, and any number of other aging CF been playing 1B the past few years? How much 1B did Bernie play. Of the 10 great CF only Mantle played any significant number of games at 1B his last two seasons.

Why didn't Griffey play at 1B? Because his team had a better option than him, considering all the factors (bat and glove). Let's look at the Reds during the last 5 seasons.

2004: Sean Casey. He not only had a better year offensively than Griffey, but he also hasn't played a single inning at any position other than 1B.

2005: Casey. He didn't have a great season this time but again, he's never played any position other than 1B.

2006: Hatteburg/Aurilia platoon. Hatteburg, as you might know, is a former catcher who got converted into a 1B presumably due to the effects of age. At this point he wasn't a realistic option at C, so they put him at his only other position - 1B. He didn't get all the at bats though - why not use Griffey? Well, Aurilia was having an excellent offensive season and he was blocked at 3B by Edwin Encarnacion. So they gave Aurilia some at bats at 1B too.

2007: Hatteburg/Votto/Conine platoon. Read rationale for Hatteburg above. Votto was of course just a prospect at this point. And Conine at this point was a full-time 1B, being nearly 40 years old and all.

2008: Votto. As you know, Votto's primary position is 1B and he had a breakout season last year.

It's all a matter of necessity. Is there any particular reason Iwamura is a better 2B than 3B? No. But the Rays have a guy called Longoria playing 3B, so Iwamura got moved to 2B. Why don't we play Nick Markakis at 1B? Because the alternatives in his natural position aren't good enough to merit that kind of move.

[Nick The Stick]

http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=Ryan%20Roberson&pos=1B&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=489251

What about this guy as a potential 1B? Does anyone know much about him? I've heard his name come up before... He isn't going to be playing for the Tigers anytime soon with the stack at 1B. Could we get away with trading Sherrill to Detroit for this guy? (Possibly more...) The Tigers are still looking for a closer...

PS. He is also a Maryland native...