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Assuming he starts the year at AAA, how would you utilize Coby Mayo?


Jim'sKid26

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31 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

I still like him at 3B long-term as I see his ceiling on both sides of the game higher than Westburg (no offense to Westy).  But ultimately agree with Frobby and RZ that the O's brass has more (and more informed) eyes on both compared to me.

A little disappointed to hear Roch chatter about Gunnar at 3B.  I hope that's just Roch speculating vs. him as a mouthpiece. 

80% reps at 3B and 20% at 1B.  We've got a handful or more of OF prospects and more stable vets this year there too.  Nothing really at 1B if Mounty isn't an option for any reason.  O'Hearn could revert to pumpkin status (I don't think so but he's done it before), Mounty track and health record isn't exactly a solid/high floor either.  Basallo is a 1B option but he's on the C path too.  So there's PAs available at 1B if one thing goes sideways.

I'm "willing" to sacrifice his arm at 1B because other options (ahem HK) look lost at 1B (and more competent elsewhere).

I also hope Roch is wrong about not being on the OD roster.  A few things have to break right for that to happen, but there are ways...  If he's not on OD, he's a guy they could slow roll until August (assuming we're competitive without him), have him on the PO roster and still have a ROY shot in 2025.  Bradish's health impacts the math too...

What did he say about Gunnar that you are upset about?

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2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

What did he say about Gunnar that you are upset about?

I'd like to see Gunnat at SS the vast majority of his reps.  Roch mentioned a SS/3B split (like last year maybe).  Not upset, disappointed.  But I also trust that Elias knows more than I do.

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1 minute ago, btdart20 said:

I'd like to see Gunnat at SS the vast majority of his reps.  Roch mentioned a SS/3B split (like last year maybe).  Not upset, disappointed.  But I also trust that Elias knows more than I do.

Well he didn’t say it was a split in terms of equal time or anything.  He said he will play both and that is what Elias has said publicly.

Gunnar isn’t an elite defensive SS..maybe he will grow into one but he’s not now.  
 

His best defensive position is still probably third.

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1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

Gunnar isn’t an elite defensive SS..maybe he will grow into one but he’s not now.  
 

His best defensive position is still probably third.

In isolation, no disagreement.  But you know the conversation goes into the roster construct too and can't be isolated to just Gunnar.

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1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

See if he starts mashing at AAA, have him learn how to play first base while he's there.  If he's mashing, trade Mountcastle and promote him, get him in the 1B/DH rotation with O'Hearn.  

So he would be a LHP only platooner? 

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Mayo would be the first callup if there was an injury to "starters" Gunnar, Westburg, Holliday.  I wouldn't start moving Mayo around until there was an injury/performace issue to necessitate it.  Just let the big fella mash and focus on one position for now.  We probably don't have an OD spot for Cowser on the OD roster.  Mayo is behind Cowser and Kjsertad for a COF spot as of now.  

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16 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Well he didn’t say it was a split in terms of equal time or anything.  He said he will play both and that is what Elias has said publicly.

Gunnar isn’t an elite defensive SS..maybe he will grow into one but he’s not now.  
 

His best defensive position is still probably third.

DRS says Gunnar is upper eschelon at SS, link to old Hangout thread on this topic and Link to DRS leaderboard for SS in 2023

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1 hour ago, btdart20 said:

I still like him at 3B long-term as I see his ceiling on both sides of the game higher than Westburg (no offense to Westy).  But ultimately agree with Frobby and RZ that the O's brass has more (and more informed) eyes on both compared to me.

A little disappointed to hear Roch chatter about Gunnar at 3B.  I hope that's just Roch speculating vs. him as a mouthpiece. 

80% reps at 3B and 20% at 1B.  We've got a handful or more of OF prospects and more stable vets this year there too.  Nothing really at 1B if Mounty isn't an option for any reason.  O'Hearn could revert to pumpkin status (I don't think so but he's done it before), Mounty track and health record isn't exactly a solid/high floor either.  Basallo is a 1B option but he's on the C path too.  So there's PAs available at 1B if one thing goes sideways.

I'm "willing" to sacrifice his arm at 1B because other options (ahem HK) look lost at 1B (and more competent elsewhere).

I also hope Roch is wrong about not being on the OD roster.  A few things have to break right for that to happen, but there are ways...  If he's not on OD, he's a guy they could slow roll until August (assuming we're competitive without him), have him on the PO roster and still have a ROY shot in 2025.  Bradish's health impacts the math too...

It would make no sense for him to be on the Opening Day roster unless there is a spot for him to play EVERY DAY.  We don't need to have him sitting 3 or 4 games a week like we did (in a more extreme way) with Stowers last year.  And, I think the only way he has an every day spot is if some trades happen to open things up.

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Just now, Say O! said:

Yep..and OAA said he was about league average, maybe slightly above.

Personally, I think both are wrong and neither has enough of a sampling in year 1 to mean a lot.

But I think he’s in the middle. I think he’s above average defensively at SS but I think he can be an elite third baseman.

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26 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Gunnar isn’t an elite defensive SS..maybe he will grow into one but he’s not now.  

In only 64 starts at SS, he was +9 Rtot, +10 Rdrs, +7.4 UZR.   Those are pretty elite numbers.   He was 0 OAA, which isn’t elite.  So it depends what defensive stats you like.  To my eye, he was well above average.  Elite is one of those words where I don’t quite know what it means.  Top 3?  Top 5?  Top 10?  Among players with 350 innings at SS, he was 1st in UZR/150 and Rdrs/yr, 2nd in Rtot/yr.

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1 minute ago, Sanity Check said:

It would make no sense for him to be on the Opening Day roster unless there is a spot for him to play EVERY DAY.  We don't need to have him sitting 3 or 4 games a week like we did (in a more extreme way) with Stowers last year.  And, I think the only way he has an every day spot is if some trades happen to open things up.

Agreed.  The theory would be that if his ceiling is higher than Westburg 's then he should play more and pay the rookie tax early in the season.  Westburg becomes the Urias.  Urias becomes...

I don't think it happens either.  I think Elias likes the lesser risk factor that Westburg represents in 2024 while Holliday adjusts.

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Just now, Frobby said:

In only 64 starts at SS, he was +9 Rtot, +10 Rdrs, +7.4 UZR.   Those are pretty elite numbers.   He was 0 OAA, which isn’t elite.  So it depends what defensive stats you like.  To my eye, he was well above average.  Elite is one of those words where I don’t quite know what it means.  Top 3?  Top 5?  Top 10?  Among players with 350 innings at SS, he was 1st in UZR/150 and Rdrs/yr, 2nd in Rtot/yr.

I think elite is you are the best of the best. Competing for a “real” gold glove consistently.  It’s definitely better than just top 10. 

I don’t think the 2023 version of Gunnar is or will be that guy. Again, he may develop more over there, I’m not saying that can’t happen but his size is a detriment. It’s one he can overcome but it’s still an issue and he doesn’t figure to get smaller either.

 

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22 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I think elite is you are the best of the best. Competing for a “real” gold glove consistently.  It’s definitely better than just top 10. 

I don’t think the 2023 version of Gunnar is or will be that guy. Again, he may develop more over there, I’m not saying that can’t happen but his size is a detriment. It’s one he can overcome but it’s still an issue and he doesn’t figure to get smaller either.

 

Since his top 10 DRS was put up in only 80+ games at SS, I'd say elite is not an understatement. I don't know that he will maintain that pace but it's an accurate statement. 

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Just now, Aristotelian said:

Since his top 10 DRS was put up in only 80+ games at SS, I'd say elite is not an understatement. I don't know that he will maintain that pace but it's an accurate statement. 

And if you use OAA, he’s not close to elite. 
 

Too much noise in any defensive stat, especially in a SSS, to draw definitive conclusions from them.

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