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The Difference between the O's and other Playoff teams

Sanity Check

By Sanity Check
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Sanity Check Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Sanity Check

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I am noticing a pattern the differentiates us from the other playoff teams, and not in a good way.

The Mets, Phillies, Tigers Royals, Dodgers and Padres pretty much have set lineups, where their batters will face both lefties and righties.  Not exclusively, but there is very little in the way of platooning or switching out a left-handed hitter for a right-handed hitter, or vice versa.  These teams go with their main guys for the most part, even if their name is Jose Iglesias, Mike Massey, or whoever.

I always feel like we need guys who can hit lefties and righties for success, and I realize that there will be splits that say they are better against one vs. the other.  That will always be the case, and has always been the case.  I know the 1983 team was built a bit on platoons, but that actually worked for that team. 

From what I am seeing, consistency and chemistry seem to be playing well with  playoff teams.  Even the Diamondbacks and Rangers last year had pretty set lineups, and very few substitutions/platooning.

So, do we have a roster construction issue, or is Hyde just over-managing.  As in, for example, can Mountcastle not hit righties and O'Hearn can't hit lefites?  Our pinch hitters and platoon guys did nothing meaningful for us in the playoffs.  Is this part of our problem???

And, not to get lost in all of this, don't we need bullpen guys who can get out lefties or righties??  I am so tired of over-playing matchups to our detriment, why not just bring in pitchers who can be effective against anyone, regardless of which side of the plate they stand on?

Any thought here?  

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Aristotelian Hangout Grand Counsel

Aristotelian

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I agree. I also think the platoon mentality becomes self fulfilling in that our guys don't get the chances they need to develop against same side pitching, especially left on left. For example, Kjerstad has only 17 AB against LHP. 

Then again, Mullins and O'Hearn are absolutely unplayable vs lefties, but they have some value so I get it. Now that we are losing Santander we might expect even more of this platoon style unless he is replaced.

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Brooks The Great Major Leaguer

Brooks The Great

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Elias and Hyde over-platoon. That's one of a few reasons I've wanted to move on from O'Hearn - even before the 2024 season started - in order to give Kjerstad and Mayo (neither of whom are hitters who need to be platooned) regular at bats at the DH spot, in addition to other positions on the field.

I fully believe that bringing O'Hearn back this season and giving him way too much playing time in the DH spot severly handicapped this team's offensive ceiling because Norby, Kjerstad, and Mayo were all blocked from getting at bats at DH (with the awful Eloy Jimenez also blocking Mayo at DH later in the season).

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e16bball Major Leaguer

e16bball

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What would you say if I told you that KC, CLE, DET, and MIL all pinch hit more than we did this season? As did ARI, which led the league in runs by a mile and had some degree of playoff success last year?

DET rather famously strictly platoons their best hitter, in addition to much of the rest of their lineup. And KC has strictly platooned multiple spots in their lineup as well. Isbel and Melendez are both awful against LHPs, and they’ve traditionally hit for Garcia against RHPs in big spots as well.

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Sanity Check Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Sanity Check

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I wasn't focused on the regular season, but more of what seems to be working in the playoffs right now.  Again, realizing the there are some guys being switched out, I just feel like we were more extreme with those substitutions.  I realize it was only 2 games for us in the playoffs, but is it better to bat someone who has been in the flow of the game or a guy who stands in the other batters box?  

But my main point it, maybe the O's should try to acquire/develop guys who can be successful regardless of who is on the mound, and not awful against either a righty or a lefty.

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Ripken Hangout Veteran Council

Ripken

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You mean like not letting Cowser face lefties all year, even though he hit them in the minors, and then having him take the biggest at bat of the entire season against a leftie?  

Someone is obsessed with L/R & R/L matchups, even in the face of reverse splits, to the detriment of the team.

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btdart20 Hangout Veteran Council

btdart20

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Talent plays in the matchup.  LAD isn't benching Ohtani or Betts.  SDP isn't benching Machado or Tatis.  ATL isn't platooning Acuna or Olson.  NYY isn't platooning Judge or Soto.  We aren't platooning Gunnar or Santander.

But every team has players that are platooned to some degree.  There are definitely places to sit Renfroe or JD Martinez.  If Hinch doesn't sit Carpenter against most LHP, that's gross negligence.  Almost as bad as if HOU didn't platoon their 1B.  NYY brought in Verdugo as a platoon-type.

Scope-wise MIL, TBR, SFG seem to platoon as much as we do.  Just a swag on my part.  Deep benches are important for the marathon.  But Carl Lewis and Usain Bolt need to anchor the 4x100 relay to the WS.

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JR Oriole Major Leaguer

JR Oriole

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I am not honestly sure if we do things any differently than anyone else. I just think much of what we see and pick apart is really a by-product of frustration from watching a bad baseball team for the last 90 games of the season, capped off with a really pathetic offensive effort against KC.  

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theobird All-Star

theobird

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Kjerstad is the one that really bothers me. The guy has a strong minor league track record of hitting lefties, but he may never get the chance on the O’s. There is definitely a strong LH/Rh thing going on in Baltimore , and I think it’s pretty dumb in some cases.

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Say O! Major Leaguer

Say O!

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1 hour ago, e16bball said:

What would you say if I told you that KC, CLE, DET, and MIL all pinch hit more than we did this season? As did ARI, which led the league in runs by a mile and had some degree of playoff success last year?

DET rather famously strictly platoons their best hitter, in addition to much of the rest of their lineup. And KC has strictly platooned multiple spots in their lineup as well. Isbel and Melendez are both awful against LHPs, and they’ve traditionally hit for Garcia against RHPs in big spots as well.

Dont let facts get in the way of another false OH narrative 🙂

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24fps Hangout Grand Counsel

24fps

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192 wins in two seasons is a pretty strong argument to stay the course.  That said, I wonder if the young players wouldn't be better off long-term if the scientific matchups took a back seat to the raw talent a little more than we've seen.  Overthinking something can be a thing you know.

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OsFanSinceThe80s Hangout Grand Counsel

OsFanSinceThe80s

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Ripken said:

You mean like not letting Cowser face lefties all year, even though he hit them in the minors, and then having him take the biggest at bat of the entire season against a leftie?  

Someone is obsessed with L/R & R/L matchups, even in the face of reverse splits, to the detriment of the team.

And we've seen similar with Kjerstad. Kjerstad might be the best pure hitting prospect in the Orioles system of recent years besides Gunnar. I want to see him playing everyday next year is possible none of this sitting him versus LHP more often than not.

These prospects need to get their reps and stop treating them like John Lowenstein and Benny Ayala.

Edited by OsFanSinceThe80s
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  • Posts

    • bpilktree67
      The Difference between the O's and other Playoff teams

      By bpilktree67 · Posted

      I honestly think there is very little difference in most the teams that made the playoffs.  The most wins was 98 wins and there was 12 teams with 86 wins or more.  It also seems that many of the teams are on the same page with scouting and analytics now hitting wise.  Years back you had moneyball which the A’s used before anyone else.  Then the Astros and few teams started with analytics and seemed to be ahead of the rest of the league but they have caught up now imo.  Now the move seems to be on launch angle and hitting homers by getting the ball in the air but that seems to be across the league.  Obviously some teams have more money and more talented players but the strategy seems about the same.  The main differences I see is in pitching in the playoffs which is bullpen games and using openers rather then a starter to go 7 innings and carry your team to win now a slight sign of trouble they are taking them out.  With all these short inning guys and pitching them in certain pockets we are seeing very little offense and the hitting with runners in scoring position has been awful.  It all comes down to RISP at bats and getting 1 or 2 big base hits in those situations.  We just haven’t been able to get those hits so far in short series.  
    • OsFanSinceThe80s
      The Difference between the O's and other Playoff teams

      By OsFanSinceThe80s · Posted

      And we've seen similar with Kjerstad. Kjerstad might be the best pure hitting prospect in the Orioles system of recent years besides Gunnar. I want to see him playing everyday next year is possible none of this sitting him versus LHP more often than not. These prospects need to get their reps and stop treating them like John Lowenstein and Benny Ayala.
    • bpilktree67
      Offseason Trade Pondering

      By bpilktree67 · Posted

      I don’t see Elias trading off prospects anymore at least top guys.  We have moved a few guys in last year and I expect they try to build that back up.  They should have money to use if they want to add talent.  
    • OsFanSinceThe80s
      Other teams playoffs game thread

      By OsFanSinceThe80s · Posted

      Blah, well Rob Manfred has to be happy along with Fox network. A Yankees-Mets World Series match up is still on the table and the Dodgers as well if they win tomorrow. I knew the Royals would get jettisoned by the Yankees without too much of a fight.
    • Roll Tide
      Offseason Trade Pondering

      By Roll Tide · Posted

      For Mountcastle …Maybe Chase Petty and Tristan Smith?
    • Roll Tide
      Offseason Trade Pondering

      By Roll Tide · Posted

      I’m guessing they ask for Mayo or Basallo of Kjerstad. For me …I’d give them Kjerstad since he’s defensively challenged IMO. Maybe Kjerstad, McDermott, Beavers, and O’Ferrall? 
    • 24fps
      The Difference between the O's and other Playoff teams

      By 24fps · Posted

      192 wins in two seasons is a pretty strong argument to stay the course.  That said, I wonder if the young players wouldn't be better off long-term if the scientific matchups took a back seat to the raw talent a little more than we've seen.  Overthinking something can be a thing you know.

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