Markakis

[Frobby]

I'd give him a few more weeks. A few days ago everyone was saying Hardy should be dropped to the bottom of the order, now he has gotten hot and everyone's happy. If Nick hasn't had a similar awakening by the end of the month, I could see moving him down. But I am not pushing the panic button yet by any means.

[Brendan25]

I'd give him a few more weeks. A few days ago everyone was saying Hardy should be dropped to the bottom of the order, now he has gotten hot and everyone's happy. If Nick hasn't had a similar awakening by the end of the month, I could see moving him down. But I am not pushing the panic button yet by any means.

I don't think that Markakis is a #3 hitter even when he is his best.

[Frobby]

I don't think that Markakis is a #3 hitter even when he is his best.

I would prefer him at no. 2, but it's not like we have a lot of great candidates for no. 3. What would you do, flip Markakis and Hardy? Move Jones and Wieters up a spot?

[Brendan25]

I would prefer him at no. 2, but it's not like we have a lot of great candidates for no. 3. What would you do, flip Markakis and Hardy? Move Jones and Wieters up a spot?

I actually like the idea of Davis as a cleanup hitter, despite his struggles the past two games.

Andino

Markakis

Jones

Davis

Wieters

Betemit

[Can_of_corn]

I actually like the idea of Davis as a cleanup hitter, despite his struggles the past two games.

Andino

Markakis

Jones

Davis

Wieters

Betemit

I want a higher OBP from the #4 hitter, since statically speaking, he is going to lead off an inning pretty often.

[Frobby]

Let's face it, we don't have a true #3 hitter. I'm not sure we have a true #4 hitter either. Still, it seems as though it falls into the category of "it can't hurt" to move Markakis to the #2 spot and see what happens. Whether that means making Hardy the #3 hitter or making Jones the #3, Wieters #4, and moving Hardy further down, who knows.

Just who are the "true" no. 3 and 4 hitters in baseball, anyway? Right now only 22 teams in MLB have a no. 3 hitter who has 3 AB/game in that spot. Of those, only 11 have an OPS over .800. Looking at no. 4, only 11 teams have a player who has 3 AB/game in that spot, 5 of whom have an OPS below .800. And guess who has the most AB in the no. 4 spot of any hitter? Adam Jones, whose .918 OPS is second-best among those with 3 AB/game in the 4-hole. The O's are 10th overall in the AL (21st in MLB) in OPS from the no. 3 spot, 2nd in the AL (5th in MLB) in the no. 4 spot.

[markdublya]

As I put in another thread, Slugging % last 5 seasons, .491, .453, .436, .406, .372 (season to date). U can't get too excited about that trend. Injury or not, this didn't start last season...

[Can_of_corn]

Your #3 hitter should be your 5th best hitter (using avoiding outs as the defining metric).

Honestly I am continually amazed that a board with such a high baseball IQ keeps getting caught up in lineup position discussions.

The proper lineup (according to The Book is #1, #4, #2, #5, #3, #6, #7, #8, #9. Using a random batting order instead of that one impacts runs less Jose Molina's ability to frame a pitch.

[jtschrei]

They should flip flop Hardy and Markakis. Markakis just has not developed. He's regressed and he's overpaid. His approach is way more aggressive and his numbers have suffered. He swings at so many bad pitches now. I'm not saying he's a bad player; he's not. I still like him b/c he keeps his mouth shut, plays hard, and rarely gets hurt. (knock on wood). He's just not a #3 hitter, he's not worth 11 mill, and he needs to change his approach.

I like Jones in the #4 hole. His production has NEVER been this good. You don't move Jones.

We really miss Reimold at the top of the lineup.

[Gurgi]

Roy has it right. Markakis and his endless slumps and slow starts are just getting tiresome.

He just isnt an impact player. He isnt a top 100 player. He isnt the best outfielder on the team anymore.

If I was a pitcher and wanted to avoid giving up the homerun against him I would pitch him away. If I wanted to avoid the single I would pitch him inside. Its simple now.

I would also challenge him every ab and never walk him. Jones and Wieters are way more dangerous. What is Markakis going to do? Roll over and ground the ball to second or SS?

[Pedro Cerrano]

Your #3 hitter should be your 5th best hitter (using avoiding outs as the defining metric).

Honestly I am continually amazed that a board with such a high baseball IQ keeps getting caught up in lineup position discussions.

The proper lineup (according to The Book is #1, #4, #2, #5, #3, #6, #7, #8, #9. Using a random batting order instead of that one impacts runs less Jose Molina's ability to frame a pitch.

Show me proof of this, please.

[El Gordo]

Just who are the "true" no. 3 and 4 hitters in baseball, anyway? Right now only 22 teams in MLB have a no. 3 hitter who has 3 AB/game in that spot. Of those, only 11 have an OPS over .800. Looking at no. 4, only 11 teams have a player who has 3 AB/game in that spot, 5 of whom have an OPS below .800. And guess who has the most AB in the no. 4 spot of any hitter? Adam Jones, whose .918 OPS is second-best among those with 3 AB/game in the 4-hole. The O's are 10th overall in the AL (21st in MLB) in OPS from the no. 3 spot, 2nd in the AL (5th in MLB) in the no. 4 spot.

Historically, I would think the ideal #3 hitter would be a Williams, or Musial. and the ideal #4 would be Ruth. Today the best approximation of that would be Cabrera/Prince IMO.

[Can_of_corn]

Show me proof of this, please.

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2009/3/17/795946/optimizing-your-lineup-by

The overriding source is of course The Book by Tom Tango and co.

Here is a lineup optimizing tool from Baseball Musings

http://www.baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/LineupAnalysis.py

[Pedro Cerrano]

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2009/3/17/795946/optimizing-your-lineup-by

The overriding source is of course The Book by Tom Tango and co.

Here is a lineup optimizing tool from Baseball Musings

http://www.baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/LineupAnalysis.py

Meh, I don't know how much I buy into this, but that's just me.

[Can_of_corn]

Meh, I don't know how much I buy into this, but that's just me.

How often does your #3 hitter come up with 2 outs and the bases empty? Who leads off the most innings (other then the leadoff hitter)?