Tillman

[Lucky Jim]

Yes, and Im not sure I ever heard anybody mentioning this much of an improvement or difference as a pitcher. Plus, Milb hitters vs big league hitters. If you want to try and sell that you saw this coming go ahead but Im not buying. You get props for standing behind Tillman. Clearly he deserved to stay in the rotation vs being preped as a reliever. No matter what happens in his next few starts it's clear improvements have been made and he has a chance to be a successful ML starter. Personally, I seriously doubted that. Just don't go patting yourself on the back that hard.

I offered mulitple scouting reports on what I saw, that cataloged everything but the highest velocity (on MiLB broadcasts, there's no MPH, and the announcers had him at 95MPH late, which I reported). The fact is, I respect and relied upon Peterson and an innate sense that Tillman might have the stuff to be a good MLB pitcher. You, on the other hand, refused to even watch the games.

I won't pat myself on the back. I'll just offer this:

To be quite blunt this is where I am with Tillman. I'm still hoping he can make some kind of contribution for the O's at some point in any role but he's pretty much completely off my radar right now.

We need to find out if we can salvage something of him. It's not going to be as a SP. I mean he's behind Eveland and Pinero on the MLB depth chart. He's soon to be behind Britton(fingers crossed) and conceivably could be behind Steve Johnson. It really is quite baffling hy so many people continue to be so bullish on Tillman's chances as a ML SP.

Tillman will never be a successful ML starter. I know it, you know it, Peterson knows it, Buck knows it, DD knows it, most everyone knows it.

What do you expect Peterson to say, especially about a former top prospect. The chances of him figuring it out are so low that I'm very confident saying he's not going to make it as a ML starter. I'll happily say I'm wrong if some miracle occurs.

Honest question with those of you preaching patience with Tillman as a SP???

Yes, I have the Chris Tillman package at Harbor Park. Make the 5hr trip every time he starts at home.:rolleyestf:. WHo's being the douche now??

Everything in his stats and boxscores tell me he's the same pitcher he was 2 years ago, except for the velocity increase which isreally the only reason why I even have hope for him as a RP.

Legit question eh?? Yeah, you really phrased it as a legit question. No condescension in your tone at all.

The results are the same. I'll refer back to post #65 and #73 in that regard. Yes, I have an entrenched opinion of TIllman at this point. He needs to prove to me otherwise, and yes, he can start to do that without me watching any of his games. I want to see him start getting deeper in games, limiting his pitch count, lower his BBs and become more consistent from start to start.

[Lucky Jim]

And I was only able to say that because I've been following the reports of people like Lucky Jim, weams, etc. after every Tillman start, as well as what Rick Peterson and others have said about him through the media.

I bought a MiLB package specifically so I could watch Tillman (and, occasionally, Bundy). Outside of the top-side velocity, did anything you saw today depart widely from my scouting reports? This was the best game I've seen him pitch - but all of these component parts were on display. The change-up had a bit more fade, but some of that might be the difference in camera angle, which is terrible on MiLBTV.

It's amazing that folks who refused to watch him pitch and criticized those were patient as irrational now have the audacity to try to flip it on them.

[Floater]

Tillman was ALWAYS my favorite pitcher out of Arrieta, Matsuz, Britton, and Bergy when they were all minor league prospects. Still is and I feel even better now that I see how much his velocity has improved. Of course, CT's start was against the Mariners but he seems more confident and a better pitcher after much time in the minors. I still have faith in Arrieta since the stuff is clearly there. A rotation of Hammel/Chen/Arrieta/Tillman would be my favorite to watch with the 5th starter being a question mark. If we trade for one, I don't think it will be anyone big, probably a Joe Saunders type player.

[whynot38]

Lets forget the fact that this was against the Mariners

the key is that by from what we all saw

- he had excellent command

- he had much higher velocity then we've ever seen

- he had far more movement then in the past

I dont care who he pitched against, if he keeps those three he will be a dynamic starting TOR kind of pitcher. Right now I'm hoping he shows us consistency and slots in as a superb number 3

[ccbird]

Then you haven't been paying attention. I said this earlier in this thread (earlier today, p. 6):

"Honestly, I can't say this enough: I don't think Tillman is the same pitcher as last year, or the year before. Just ask Tim Lincecum: 2-3 MPH on your FB is can make a huge difference. He was 92.0 in 2009, 90.5 in 2010, and 89.5 in 2011. My hope--and expectation--is that we're getting the 2009 version, stuff-wise, with increased maturity, more developed as a pitcher and a person."

And I was only able to say that because I've been following the reports of people like Lucky Jim, weams, etc. after every Tillman start, as well as what Rick Peterson and others have said about him through the media.

Good for you for being so optimistic. Listen, Tillman was dominant today. I just find it hard to believe anyone thought he was this good or improved. I hate to read too much into 1 start but I saw top of the rotation potential today. That is a monumental jump for me on Tillman. If someone was still claiming this potential on Tillman your either incredibly optimistic or should have a job in a ML organization.

[Bohs&O's]

Thank you Andy Macphail and Erik Bedard. Tillman be:thumbsup1:ast mode and A.J with a homer! Man I still love talking about that trade.

[weams]

Thank you Andy Macphail and Erik Bedard. Tillman be:thumbsup1:ast mode and A.J with a homer! Man I still love talking about that trade.

Steve Johnson is a product of that as well

[weams]

Good for you for being so optimistic. Listen, Tillman was dominant today. I just find it hard to believe anyone thought he was this good or improved. I hate to read too much into 1 start but I saw top of the rotation potential today. That is a monumental jump for me on Tillman. If someone was still claiming this potential on Tillman your either incredibly optimistic or should have a job in a ML organization.

I have eaten crow many times when Chris Tillman was less than stellar. He has been a work in progress and I am glad at age 24 that he appears to be taking a step forward. I have always hoped that he could fulfill the promise.

[Flash- bd]

Good for you for being so optimistic. Listen, Tillman was dominant today. I just find it hard to believe anyone thought he was this good or improved. I hate to read too much into 1 start but I saw top of the rotation potential today. That is a monumental jump for me on Tillman. If someone was still claiming this potential on Tillman your either incredibly optimistic or should have a job in a ML organization.

No one thought he was this improved just like no one believes Dylan Bundy will come into the league and tear it up a la Tim Lincecum; it's not that no one thought this was possible, it's that no one--having years of being conditioned completely to the contrary as O's fans--dared to say it. I can tell you when I was writing that post today I was about to write and 92.0 seems to be the worst-case scenario for Tillman according to reports but figured, hey, maybe his velocity fluctuates enough that he'll still even out at 92.

Lucky Jim has been pretty high on Tillman throughout, there's no need to argue that because it's all over the board here on the OH. For you to continue denying it seems begrudging at best and petulant at worst.

[backwardsk]

I can't recall being this excited about an oriole performance in a long time.

[ccbird]

I offered mulitple scouting reports on what I saw, that cataloged everything but the highest velocity (on MiLB broadcasts, there's no MPH, and the announcers had him at 95MPH late, which I reported). The fact is, I respect and relied upon Peterson and an innate sense that Tillman might have the stuff to be a good MLB pitcher. You, on the other hand, refused to even watch the games.

I won't pat myself on the back. I'll just offer this:

LOL.... thank you for reminding me of my posts....all of which were made when Tillman was off to a horrible start. All Ive done in this thread was give props to those sticking by Tillman,saying I was wrong and praising Tillman for todays starou want to sit up on your high horse and jab have at it. I respect your opinion, you are one of the best posters here but you show once again how intollerably arrogant you are .

[weams]

Tillman shuts down Mariners in season debut

By Brittany Ghiroli / MLB.com | 7/4/2012 6:51 PM ET

SEATTLE-- After patiently waiting and stringing together a nice stretch at Triple-A Norfolk, Chris Tillman -- who was thisclose to joining Baltimore's rotation several times already this season -- made one thing clear with Wednesday's impressive start: it's Tillman time.

The 24-year-old seized the opportunity to establish himself as part of the Orioles' struggling staff, which has had trouble finding consistency beyond Jason Hammel and Wei-Yin Chen, surrendering just two unearned runs over 8 1/3 innings in the finale against the Mariners for the best outing of his career.

Tillman, who has been on a shuttle back and forth to the Minor Leagues over the past three seasons, held Seattle -- an organization that made him its second-round selection in the 2006 Draft -- to just two hits to lead the Orioles to a 4-2 series-clinching win. Baltimore, which guaranteed a winning first-half record on Tuesday -- for just the second time since 1998 -- has now won 16 series, already equaling its total from the 2011 season.

Crediting an improved tempo and showcasing more confidence than he's shown in previous years, Tillman used a steady diet of fastballs -- consistently in the 95-97 mph range -- to stymie Seattle's bats and cruise the entire afternoon.

The Mariners first hit off Tillman didn't come until the fourth inning, and after Michael Saunders' single, Tillman responded by recording a pair of strikeouts to keep Seattle from setting foot on second base. He struck out seven and allowed just six baserunners on two walks and two errors.

Adam Jones, who came to Baltimore in the same trade as Tillman, got the Orioles on the board with a second-inning solo homer. Jones' blast gave him a second consecutive season with 20, his 20th last season not coming until Aug. 6.

...

But the afternoon belonged to Tillman, who ensured the Orioles' ninth road series win with a dominant 125-pitch outing to shatter his previous career high of 112. Erasing any quibbles over high-pitch counts at Triple-A, Tillman needed just 76 offerings to get through the first six frames and put on a show for the holiday crowd of 21,982.

...

Brittany Ghiroli is a reporter for MLB.com. Read her blog, Britt's Bird Watch, and follow her on Twitter @britt_ghiroli. This story was not subject to the approval of Major League Baseball or its clubs.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/gameday/index.jsp?gid=2012_07_04_balmlb_seamlb_1&mode=recap_away&c_id=bal

[Malike]

Temper your enthusiasm, folks. He had great stuff tonight, and commanded it well. He might not next time, and then people will be calling him a bust, and AAA fodder. One start at a time, and see some consistency first, I say.

[weams]

Temper your enthusiasm, folks. He had great stuff tonight, and commanded it well. He might not next time, and then people will be calling him a bust, and AAA fodder. One start at a time, and see some consistency first, I say.

Jim Palmer offered a comparison to Verlander. That is now what I expect

[Malike]

Jim Palmer offered a comparison to Verlander. That is now what I expect

Don't fall in love with baseball players, Weams! They'll always break your heart.