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Talks with the Dodgers centered around Kemp/Ethier


ChaosLex

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Kemp is owed 130 million over the next 6 years. If the Dodgers thru in 40 million +/- his contract will be about 6/90. Could we swing a deal like that? Weiters could be attractive to the Dodgers to run ther high dollar pitching staff.

Just a thought...

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Where does this budget come from is the question? If we were around $95 million last year, with the $25 million TV deal our budget should be around $120. Instead Peter is pocketing it and not spending it on the team, AND holding Duke to a tight budget ceiling. Oh, and all the while, he expects his sheep (us) to keep coming back.

Does it matter? I mean it does when finger pointing is the objective I guess. But whether the budget is set due to financial realities or because PA is hoarding money, it is what it is. If the budget is $100mm I don't want to pay Matt Kemp 1/5 of that amount.

Really you are left with two choices. Accept that the budget appears to be $100mm and root for the Orioles to do the things they need to do to win at that budget level or get mad at PA for not spending more and take your toys and go home. I certainly can understand the reasoning for doing the latter as it is pretty frustrating especially if you believe the Orioles are flush with cash.

Lets see if this quote from DD in Roch's post from last night "literally comes true"

"I think when you take a look at the trade, you have to take a look at some of the other people that we will sign here in the next couple weeks to fill out our roster in order to properly evaluate the trade."

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I am not going to get up in arms without knowing the particulars. I am assuming that the Dodgers wanted us to take on all, or at least most of Kemp or Ethier's contracts. I like both of those players, but no thanks. There is a reason that a team with limitless resources is trying to get rid of those guys. They are bad contracts; much worse than Johnson.

Kemp is obviously a very good player. But he has missed 145 games over the last two years and still has six years and $128M left on his contract. The Dodgers seem very anxious to deal a guy that should have been the NL MVP just two years ago. I have always liked Ethier, but he will be 32 soon after Opening Day, is really a middle of the road outfielder, still has four years and $69M left on his contract, and misses a lot of games himself.

We were looking to get rid of a player that we determined was not worth the contract he was set to get. Why trade him for a much worse contract? If they wanted us to take on all or most of either of those deals, I probably would have said no too.

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I'm still in wait and see mode with the O's at this juncture. But it is quite frustrating to continue to hear about spending constraints in this new flush with cash MLB environment. The Jones deal gave you some hope that things may be changing with the new winning environment. But alas it sure seems like status quo for the birds.

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About 11 years ago I needed to make some equipment purchases for my company's division, but I was rebuffed because the company was having budgetary issues. I volunteered that if I could sell some assets to raise the capital for the purchases, could I then buy the needed gear? Ownership agreed. I sold the assets, with more money raised than was needed for the new gear. When I went to acquire the needed gear, I was denied again anyhow.

I guess my point is until you actually see the money saved put back into circulation, don't trust that it ever will, particularly when budget constraints are in play.

Until I see differently, I have no faith that the Angelos family is more committed to winning than maximizing profitability. Peter is 84. Two thoughts:

1) If he isn't going to up the payroll now to make one last push for a championshipin his lifetime, then he isn't really that concerned about one. It's been 15 years since he was this close to putting a real contender on the field.

2) Constraining payroll could be an early (very early) indicator that the Angelos family does not intend to keep the Orioles when Peter is gone. If the goal is to keep the strongest P/L and balance sheet possible, that could be positioning the organization for maximum return in a future sale.

Hopefully that doesn't sound morbid. Peter looks pretty spry for his age. It's total speculation on my part to say these things, but nothing I see disproves this theory. And if it's true, Peter may be around for a long time to come. I'm adjusting my future expectations, not just this one offseason. We may be a 75-85 win perennial dud for some time to come. Hopefully not.

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So because we didn't want to spend, we end up with Weeks instead of Kemp or Ethier? If that's true, why waste our time rooting for the O's?

I thought the OH was above these type of comments. You 'waste time' because you are an Orioles fan.

To the main point of this post and this thread in general. If there was a deal for Ethier on the table and it didn't include much money coming back to the Orioles, then I am okay not taking it. His contract for 2015-2017 (with a vesting option for 2018) is quite high for a player that has such extreme splits. He's a solid player and if the Dodgers were kicking back $30M (spread throughout the life of the contract) then I would prefer Either to what we got, but if they were unwilling to kick back much money, I cannot blame them for passing.

To me, Kemp is a slightly different story. I can see him being worth his contract (or close to it) if healthy. Now, healthy is a big question mark, but at least there is a chance there. If a Johnson for Kemp deal was available it should have been taken.

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I thought the OH was above these type of comments. You 'waste time' because you are an Orioles fan.

To the main point of this post and this thread in general. If there was a deal for Ethier on the table and it didn't include much money coming back to the Orioles, then I am okay not taking it. His contract for 2015-2017 (with a vesting option for 2018) is quite high for a player that has such extreme splits. He's a solid player and if the Dodgers were kicking back $30M (spread throughout the life of the contract) then I would prefer Either to what we got, but if they were unwilling to kick back much money, I cannot blame them for passing.

To me, Kemp is a slightly different story. I can see him being worth his contract (or close to it) if healthy. Now, healthy is a big question mark, but at least there is a chance there. If a Johnson for Kemp deal was available it should have been taken.

Even with no money coming with him?

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One more thing. I owe Big T, Tony Soprano, a big apology. I have fought him all these years while I defended Angelos, and yet here we are, 20 years later, and Angelos is still the same terrible owner he has always been. I like Peter Angelos the man, and I will never shy away from that, but he just needs to sell this team and leave us alone!
Thanks, it's all good my brother from another mother.

This is how I imagine it was for you when the light went on ;)

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/lX5tfRdkoY0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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Even with no money coming with him?

Exactly. Without money coming back, I would not have done it. He is a great player when healthy, but he has not been close to healthy in two years. When healthy, he is a franchise player. You usually hang on to guys like that, yet the Dodgers seem unusually willing to deal him.

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I am not going to get up in arms without knowing the particulars. I am assuming that the Dodgers wanted us to take on all, or at least most of Kemp or Ethier's contracts. I like both of those players, but no thanks. There is a reason that a team with limitless resources is trying to get rid of those guys. They are bad contracts; much worse than Johnson.

Kemp is obviously a very good player. But he has missed 145 games over the last two years and still has six years and $128M left on his contract. The Dodgers seem very anxious to deal a guy that should have been the NL MVP just two years ago. I have always liked Ethier, but he will be 32 soon after Opening Day, is really a middle of the road outfielder, still has four years and $69M left on his contract, and misses a lot of games himself.

We were looking to get rid of a player that we determined was not worth the contract he was set to get. Why trade him for a much worse contract? If they wanted us to take on all or most of either of those deals, I probably would have said no too.

I agreee completely with this. Yes we have money to spend right now but what happens in two years. Markakis comes off the books but with raises to Davis and Tilman alone in abitration or giving them an extension that money will be gone. If either of those contracts was for maybe one or two years then i think we take on the salary but not 4-5 years down the line. Like it or not this team does not have the money to pay Davis, Tilman, Jones, Machado, and Kemp. You have to figure that is atleast 80 milllion on those 5 players. I don't want Kemp here who has struggled and had injuries then have to let Davis go who plays a position he can age better at.

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I am not going to get up in arms without knowing the particulars. I am assuming that the Dodgers wanted us to take on all, or at least most of Kemp or Ethier's contracts. I like both of those players, but no thanks. There is a reason that a team with limitless resources is trying to get rid of those guys. They are bad contracts; much worse than Johnson.

Kemp is obviously a very good player. But he has missed 145 games over the last two years and still has six years and $128M left on his contract. The Dodgers seem very anxious to deal a guy that should have been the NL MVP just two years ago. I have always liked Ethier, but he will be 32 soon after Opening Day, is really a middle of the road outfielder, still has four years and $69M left on his contract, and misses a lot of games himself.

We were looking to get rid of a player that we determined was not worth the contract he was set to get. Why trade him for a much worse contract? If they wanted us to take on all or most of either of those deals, I probably would have said no too.

:agree: This. exactly this.

DD said the problem was the money. Clearly, the Dodgers weren't offering enough salary help in the trade negotiations to make a trade for Kemp or Ethier sensible. Both of those contracts are albatrosses that would take us down. How can anyone really be upset by this?

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