Drum beat a little louder for Cubs deal

[PoorMike]

I think that the article in the sun is a little missleading. Of course all players want to win (thats obvious). The difference is if you asked roberts do you want to win THIS year with another team, or win here later if it was a gaurenteed thing, I think he would want to win here. Him wanting to win doesn't mean he WANTS to be traded, he simply wants to win.

However, speakng of the present situation, I think he's made it clear that he would prefer to be traded to a contender rather than stay here. Staying in Baltimore won't 'be the end of the world' but he'd prefer a chance to win. I don't think you can objectively interpret his comments any other way. He's had plenty of chances to stay "it's a win either way. I can stay in a place that I enjoy or I can play for a contender." He doesn't say that. He says that he likes it here, but he wants a chance to win. He's prioritizing it, and putting winning first at this stage of his career.

I think anyone who doesn't acknowledge that is seeing what he/she wants to see.

[Lou Cub]

According to numerous sources aside from Gallagher and Cedeno the O's ain't letting the Cubs know who else they want . I'd like to see it done cause this is BS and typical of Lord MacMuffin!!!!!

[Harry Carry]

Sorry, Harry, but rankings involving Cubs on that particular site can hardly be considered.

Lou Piniella is a strong and fiery field manager. He reminds me in some respects of Earl Weaver. I have always liked Lou. He picks his favorites, though, and sometimes wears his emotions on his sleeve. He has made his feelings toward both Cedeno and Marquis known, and this has no-doubt caused Hendry some headaches. Lou has certainly tried to smooth over both of those situations, but the horses had already gotten out of the barn, I'm afraid.

You, I'm sure, know better than I what Piniella's dislike for Cedeno is all about, but the situation is there, pure and simple.

The only thing Lou doesn't like about Cedeno is his bone headed base running at times. That is not the website of the Cub fan it is totally diffrent one.

[jamesenoch]

According to numerous sources aside from Gallagher and Cedeno the O's ain't letting the Cubs know who else they want . I'd like to see it done cause this is BS and typical of Lord MacMuffin!!!!!

Can you please stop with this name calling crap.

It's immature, annoying, and against the rules of this board. Grow up.

[ChaosLex]

According to numerous sources aside from Gallagher and Cedeno the O's ain't letting the Cubs know who else they want . I'd like to see it done cause this is BS and typical of Lord MacMuffin!!!!!

I find that hard to believe. If that were the truth, the Cubs would've walked away by now, IMO.

[Lou Cub]

Sorry about the name calling but 14 years of MacPhail's bologna has driven many Cub fans crazy this tactic of his is pompus and one day hopefully real soon other GM's will stick it Andy real good he acts like he's above it all, there will come a day when you guys feel the same way about Andy as the Cubs fans do trust me!!!

[Lou Cub]

I find that hard to believe. If that were the truth, the Cubs would've walked away by now, IMO.

The thing is Chaos is that Jim knows Andy well and Roberts is who the Cubs want, he'll wait him out. One of the sources who reported this was Jayson Stark I believe and since the O's had 3 scouts @ the Sean Marshall game yesterday the Cubs are being patient even though us fans are begining to lose it.

[hoosiers]

As can be expected, O's fans overvalue Roberts and Cubs fans overvalue their prospects. However, before making random statements regarding farm teams, it would be nice to actually know where the rank. The Cubs are ranked right in the middle of farm teams. One ranking ahs them 15 and the oterh 16th. Not exactly the bottom 5 or 10. IMO there is now way Roberts brings back 3 top 10, a 4th that is the 13th best prospect AND a starting SS. I expect the O's fans to overvalue Roberts, but that is not even close to fair.

Two months ago, we had Cubs fans speaking authoritatively that a BRob deal would never be more than three for one! And now look at the above rant hinting at four top 13 prospects plus Cedeno as too much!

About four or five months before that, we were told by visiting Cubs fans how worthless Steve Traschel's trade value was before our FO netted a top 10, a top 20 and a third prospect for the one month rental!

If one month of Trax is going to yield two top 16 prospects, who is to say that two years of BRob won't yield those four top 13 prospects plus Cedeno? It might not exactly end up as four top 13, but I think it well could be three top 15 plus Cedeno with a combination of a fifth prospect and/or an Orioles salary dump like Payton.

I appreciate the earnestness with which Cubs fans follow their team, but it would not surprise me after this deal goes down and we review past posts on BRob's value and realize that the biggest limiting factor to speculation on BRob's value (relative to what he will actually yield) has been the misguided influence of even the well-intentioned Chicago visitors here - similar to what happend with Trax.

[Lou Cub]

Two months ago, we had Cubs fans speaking authoritatively that a BRob deal would never be more than three for one! And now look at the above rant hinting at four top 13 prospects plus Cedeno as too much!

About four or five months before that, we were told by visiting Cubs fans how worthless Steve Traschel's trade value was before our FO netted a top 10, a top 20 and a third prospect for the one month rental!

If one month of Trax is going to yield two top 16 prospects, who is to say that two years of BRob won't yield those four top 13 prospects plus Cedeno? It might not exactly end up as four top 13, but I think it well could be three top 15 plus Cedeno with a combination of a fifth prospect and/or an Orioles salary dump like Payton.

I appreciate the earnestness with which Cubs fans follow their team, but it would not surprise me after this deal goes down and we review past posts on BRob's value and realize that the biggest limiting factor to speculation on BRob's value (relative to what he will actually yield) has been the misguided influence of even the well-intentioned Chicago visitors here - similar to what happend with Trax.

Hoosier's Scott Moore had absolutely NO FUTURE with the Cubs, Piniella didn't like him coming out of spring training last year for not speaking up about an injury and then using it for an excuse to explain his poor performance. Rocky Cherry has good stuff but @ 26 or 27 isn't as high a prospect as some of the othe young guys coming up through ourorganization plus the Cubs pen was considered a team strength when the deal was made. Hendry wants Roberts it's obvious he's been after him since November but MacPhail is mor edeliberate than anybody at anytime or anywhere in any particular situation. A deal wll be made but you guys ain't got a clue about value.

[RShack]

Oh, dear... Cubbie trolls being pissy again... who woulda thunk it?

Too bad their GM doesn't just take his ball and go home. You'd think they'd be taking out their whatever-it-is on him, not us. We're just minding our own business...

[Sports Guy]

Where is that reported. Last I heard the Cubs FO denied they offered Ceda. I just don't see 3 top prospects and a starting SS. Maybe something cloes to that, but that return is too high, IMO.

Also, the Cubs system is not a bottom 5 farm system.

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60748

[Fairfax Bird]

Well then, there is this from Denver Post via Fannation.com:

The expectation is that the Cubs will eventually ship off starter Jason Marquis to Boston for center fielder Coco Crisp. Chicago has clearly soured on Felix Pie. It wouldn't be a surprise to see Pie included in the Brian Roberts deal with Baltimore.

Interesting.

[clapdiddy]

Well then, there is this from Denver Post via Fannation.com:

The expectation is that the Cubs will eventually ship off starter Jason Marquis to Boston for center fielder Coco Crisp. Chicago has clearly soured on Felix Pie. It wouldn't be a surprise to see Pie included in the Brian Roberts deal with Baltimore.

Interesting.

If this is true, who else would you think would be coming with Pie?

I wonder if there's any chance this deal may be somewhat expanded? I'm not talking about us including Payton...but maybe a lefty the Cubs could use in the bullpen???

[Cubsfan]

It amazes me that some Cub fans present the obvious fact that teams rarely trade a player with Roberts' skill set with 2 years remaining on his contract as somehow supporting their contention that the rumored Cubs' offer is as good as it gets.

Sorry, but that dog don't hunt.

Roberts salary is not an issue. He is certainly not a clubhouse problem, and is well liked and respected by the front office and ownership. He is a fan favorite and has been a true asset to the Baltimore community. He has two years remaining on his contract and is only 30 years old. On top of all that, he's a darn good player.

The Orioles don't need to trade Roberts by any means. It isn't even entirely accurate to say they want to trade him. Fact is they have made it clear that they are willing to trade him if, and only if, they can get a package in return that would in all likelihood have a real positive impact on the team's rebuilding effort.

The thought that the Orioles will be unloading Roberts for the best offer is, quite simply, mistaken. Everything that McPhail has said and done has supported his statement after Bedard was traded that the Orioles would be looking for quality over quantity in any trade, since the quantity needs were met pretty well by the Tejada and Bedard trades.

I agree with all of the good things you say about Roberts, but the bolded paragraph isn't quite accurate. If the O's don't need or want to trade Roberts, then why have they "negotiated" (used loosely) for 3 1/2 months with a team that isn't offering the package that they want. Hendry is catching hell from fans for being part of this nightmare, but at least he's admitting that he wants to make a trade. All McPhail had to say 3 months ago was "no, your offer isn't even close and don't call again unless the deal contains Player X, Y, and Z." Whether you support McPhail or not, he knows that Roberts' trade value is at it's peak right now and holding onto Roberts might be a popular PR move, but it wouldn't be in the best interest of rebuilding the O's.

[Ruzious]

Info on Marquis and the Cubs 4th/5th starter situation from Yahoo sports:

Mar 20 Dempster allowed just one hit and two walks over 5.1 scoreless innings Wednesday while striking out seven, the Cubs' web site reports. "He threw the ball as well as I've ever seen him throw it," Cubs manager Lou Piniella said.

Recommendation: This complicates the picture as Jon Lieber and Jason Marquis had been pitching better than Dempster, but Dempster showed on Wednesday that he has the highest ceiling of the three. We had recently predicted Lieber and Marquis would win the last two rotation spots, but now it looks like maybe Dempster is the surest thing of the three.