Why trade Roberts?

[ScottieBaseball]

I still stand by my statement that if a bad team (at the time) like the Cubs were able to sign Soriano, I don't see why the same wouldn't hold true for the O's and Teixeira. Seems pretty straightforward to me...

I think you and I agree then.

[ChaosLex]

I think you and I agree then.

Sorry, I didn't mean to make it sound otherwise. My comment was directed at rynomites.

My bad.

[rynomites]

I still stand by my statement that if a bad team (at the time) like the Cubs were able to sign Soriano, I don't see why the same wouldn't hold true for the O's and Teixeira. Seems pretty straightforward to me...

Let me spell it out for you: Aramis Ramirez, Derek Lee, Carlos Zambrano, Kerry Wood...etc, etc. Do you get the picture now?

[ChaosLex]

Let me spell it out for you: Aramis Ramirez, Derek Lee, Carlos Zambrano, Kerry Wood...etc, etc. Do you get the picture now?

We have our share of good players (i.e., Markakis, Roberts, Jones, Weiters, etc.) too. Your argument is flawed, IMO.

[ScottieBaseball]

Let me spell it out for you: Aramis Ramirez, Derek Lee, Carlos Zambrano, Kerry Wood...etc, etc. Do you get the picture now?

This time next season Nick Markakis, Adam Jones, and Brian Roberts might offer similar curb appeal and optimistic outlook. I'm not suggesting I have a crystal ball or anything. The recurring theme with your posts seems to be so black and white. There's way too much unpredictable gray area that you don't seem to recognize.

As it pertains to Texiera, it's also worth pointing out the allure of playing for your hometown team.

[ChaosLex]

This time next season Nick Markakis, Adam Jones, and Brian Roberts might offer similar curb appeal and optimistic outlook. I'm not suggesting I have a crystal ball or anything. The recurring theme with your posts seems to be so black and white. There's way too much unpredictable gray area that you don't seem to recognize.

As it pertains to Texiera, it's also worth pointing out the allure of playing for your hometown team.

Yep, not to mention our starting pitching. I really hope a few of those guys take the next step this year.

[davearm]

One of our insiders (I believe it was either bigbird or Belkast) about a year ago said that Angelos is preparing to offer Teixeira the biggest contract in Orioles history. I'm not sure how much things have changed now that MacPhail's with the team, but considering how we're starved for a hard-hitting, legitimate 1B (instead of veterans like Millar, Palmiero, etc.), I'd say Teixeira's still in the plans.

Also, as geschinger pointed out, being a Boras client, Teixeira is going to sign where the money is. I'd say it's extremely telling that one of the teams you listed (i.e., the Braves) haven't been able to sign Teixeira to an extension yet.

This doesn't say much.

Is Tejada's 6/$72M the biggest ever?

That obviously does't even get you a seat at the table for Tex.

In fact they could double that total value to something like 8/$144 and still not be the high bidder.

[ChaosLex]

This doesn't say much.

Is Tejada's 6/$72M the biggest ever?

That obviously does't even get you a seat at the table for Tex.

In fact they could double that total value to something like 8/$144 and still not be the high bidder.

If I recall correctly, the source said that Angelos is prepared to do whatever it takes to get Teixeira, including emptying the bank.

[davearm]

Don't forget that the 3rd most sought after items at the trade deadline are leadoff hitters/speed guys. How many times was Rickey Henderson traded? Not that I think Brian is in his class per say, but same principle. Depends on the team and the philosophy of that team. Plenty of teams out there still believe in traditional leadoff men, and the ability to steal bases, and those teams will pay for those qualities much like teams pay for 3 or 4 hitters or SP.

If Roberts 1st half is more like his 2nd half last year, we will have a much better offer than the Cubs deal.

This argument would hold much more weight if you could/would support it with some examples.

As it is, you've given us no reason to believe the assertions you're making.

[davearm]

SG - FWIW...on WGN radio the other night, Kaplan said the 5th guy was Colvin. Kaplan made it sound like they were close with the 4 guys, maybe Hendry even thought they had a deal. Then MacPhail tried to get one more player. At that point, Hendry walked away.

I said a few days ago that my suspicion about what happened here is that Hendry finally "caved" to MacPhail's demand to include Ceda as the fourth player, fully believing that was the last hurdle to pushing the deal through.

Only MacPhail came back and asked for even more. That was ridiculous and insulting, and ultimately killed the deal. As well it should have.

[davearm]

I thought the post your were replying to was a good one. I cant say that I agree with your point here.

The problem with the deal is WHO'S THE STUD COMING TO THE O'S???

There isn't one in the list except maybe Ceda. Sorry but IMO the key player isnt going to be a reliever.

There's no stud coming back for Roberts. Not from the Cubs and not from any other team, either.

[Pickles]

This argument would hold much more weight if you could/would support it with some examples.

As it is, you've given us no reason to believe the assertions you're making.

I think its kind of silly to be saying the #1 desired assest at the deadline is X; number two is Y. What contending teams desire at the deadline are good ballplayers who improve their team and fill a hole for them. Different teams have different holes so their needs will be different.

However, I'd say a pretty good example of the fact that contending teams are always looking for top of the order hitters come stretch drive time is the career of Mr. Kenny Lofton, who- almost yearly it seems- is traded to a contending team looking for a leadoff/speed guy.

[ScottieBaseball]

I said a few days ago that my suspicion about what happened here is that Hendry finally "caved" to MacPhail's demand to include Ceda as the fourth player, fully believing that was the last hurdle to pushing the deal through.

Only MacPhail came back and asked for even more. That was ridiculous and insulting, and ultimately killed the deal. As well it should have.

Okay, just keep in mind that it's suspicion. It sounds as plausible as several of the other explanations as to what's caused this to drag but no one knows for sure.

[ChaosLex]

There's no stud coming back for Roberts. Not from the Cubs and not from any other team, either.

That's fine. I'd rather keep him anyway. It's bad enough having a crappy SS. I don't know if I could deal with a crappy SS and 2B.

[davearm]

I think its kind of silly to be saying the #1 desired assest at the deadline is X; number two is Y. What contending teams desire at the deadline are good ballplayers who improve their team and fill a hole for them. Different teams have different holes so their needs will be different.

However, I'd say a pretty good example of the fact that contending teams are always looking for top of the order hitters come stretch drive time is the career of Mr. Kenny Lofton, who- almost yearly it seems- is traded to a contending team looking for a leadoff/speed guy.

Lofton's been traded a lot, for sure.

However that's not the guy you want to build an argument around though, once you look at the returns on those various deals.

In fact he's a prime counterargument to the notion that a team will offer a ton for a speed/leadoff guy at the deadline.

The one time the Cubs acquired Lofton in July, the cost was one good prospect (Bobby Hill), and one junk veteran. Oh and Aramis Ramirez came along with Lofton.