Well, that moved my needle

[WEAVERMAN]

12 hours ago, TradeAngelos said:

He is 34. And owed 88m over the next 3.25 years. There is a better chance of Angelos selling the team tomorrow. To the Lerner's.

That's funny.

[25 Nuggets]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

There's a significant difference between Verlander and Davis.    Verlander came up with the Tigers, has been there 13 years, won a Cy Young and finished in the top 5 times, won an MVP, pitched in the World Series twice.     He's closer to being Jim Palmer than he is to being Chris Davis, in terms of the PR hit the team would take by waiving him.    And it's not like he's done as a pitcher (4.29 ERA this year), he just isn't worth $28 mm.

A part of me definitely wants Verlander to be a Tigers lifer.  Too few players today get to do that.  He could eclipse Hal Newhouser as the greatest Tigers pitcher in history.

[Frobby]

13 hours ago, TradeAngelos said:

He is 34. And owed 88m over the next 3.25 years. There is a better chance of Angelos selling the team tomorrow. To the Lerner's.

Just want to point out that he's only owed $88 mm if he finishes in the top 5 for the Cy Young in 2019.    If he actually did that, I'd feel pretty good about taking on his contract.    

[Lucky_13]

Just a thought but he's also shown he's capable of coming out of the bullpen. So if he fails as as starter, I could see him succeeding as a setup man/closer with his stuff. Now it would still be a pretty big sunk cost but its not like Ubaldo who sucks as a starter and is incapable of being a valuable piece of the pen. 

[TommyPickles]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

Trouble is, if we put in a waiver claim, the Tigers could just let him go and we'd be on the hook for the whole $28 mm/yr the next two years.

It's not impossible that he'd be worth it -- per fangraphs, the last 4 years he's been worth $22.3, $22.8, $45.1 and (projected) $25.3 mm.    But 35-36 is a dangerous age to assume a pitcher will continue to produce at the levels of the recent past.    

Yea makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the clarification.

[BohKnowsBmore]

4 hours ago, Frobby said:

We could discuss a deal once he clears waivers, though.    That wouldn't surprise me completely.

Could be interesting. 

Your thoughts on something like:

Os get:

Verlander

$20MM cash

Tigers get:

Ubaldo (open a spot and further offset JV money owed)

PTBNL

[Frobby]

5 minutes ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

Could be interesting. 

Your thoughts on something like:

Os get:

Verlander

$20MM cash

Tigers get:

Ubaldo (open a spot and further offset JV money owed)

PTBNL

If the PTBNL was your typical roster fodder who gets moved in deals like that, I'd do it in a heartbeat.    But if it was a top 10 prospect, no.   In between, I'd need to think about it.   

[BohKnowsBmore]

5 minutes ago, Frobby said:

If the PTBNL was your typical roster fodder who gets moved in deals like that, I'd do it in a heartbeat.    But if it was a top 10 prospect, no.   In between, I'd need to think about it.   

For the sake of argument, let's say it's something along the lines of better than "roster fodder," but at the very back end of guys even considered prospects. 

[eddie83]

4 minutes ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

For the sake of argument, let's say it's something along the lines of better than "roster fodder," but at the very back end of guys even considered prospects. 

If the Tigers are going to eat money they would have to get back a solid prospect. I mean why not just hold on to him in 18 and try to deal him then? 

[BohKnowsBmore]

2 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

If the Tigers are going to eat money they would have to get back a solid prospect. I mean why not just hold on to him in 18 and try to deal him then? 

Who in our system do you see as the lowest rated guy that gets it done? Maybe a group of guys if you think identifying a single guy is asking to be too precise?

 

 

[jamalshw]

5 minutes ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

For the sake of argument, let's say it's something along the lines of better than "roster fodder," but at the very back end of guys even considered prospects. 

Pending what the actual $$ we are willing to spend over the next few years is and how the $20MM is allotted over the course of the contract, i would be willing to go as far as a 10-15 range guy in the system.

[eddie83]

Just now, BohKnowsBmore said:

Who in our system do you see as the lowest rated guy that gets it done? Maybe a group of guys if you think identifying a single guy is asking to be too precise?

 

 

I honestly don't know. This is a tricky situation. Apparently he has been placed on waivers already. I am curious to find out what happens. 

Look I don't see it happening. I just think the idea isn't as crazy as some people think. 

[eddie83]

4 minutes ago, jamalshw said:

Pending what the actual $$ we are willing to spend over the next few years is and how the $20MM is allotted over the course of the contract, i would be willing to go as far as a 10-15 range guy in the system.

The Tigers have money. This isn't like they are Oakland or Tampa.  

To me I just think if they move a player of his stature they are going to have to get legit talent back. Any team would like to save money. That said this isn't a small market team. 

Ask yourself this. What would Verlander be worth if he was owed  $19M a year instead of $28M? Take on someone like O'Day and then what? 

[OFFNY]

18 hours ago, Frobby said:

 

I read a lot of posts saying that the Hellickson and Beckham trades "didn't move the needle." Maybe not, but this game certainly moved the needle! Loved what Mr. H and Mr. B brought to this one!

 

o

 

Did it move you needle enough to reacquire your long-time hobby?

 

o

[Frobby]

2 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Did it move you needle enough to reacquire your long-time hobby?

 

o

Well, I never really abandoned it, but I still haven't gone back to turning on the TV immediately after dinner.   I tend to do other stuff until about 9 pm while keeping track of the game on my phone, then watching some or all of the late innings if it's interesting.    But I'm definitely getting more engaged now that the starting pitchers have started to come through more often.