Jump to content

TT: Orioles Games of Thrones and the Way Forward

Tony-OH

By Tony-OH
in Orioles Talk

Recommended Posts

weams Hangout Grand Counsel

weams

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

So why didn't they trade for him?  You think it would have cost a lot to obtain him?  Seems to me they picked up an equivalent player off the waiver wire.

Guys you can replace off the waiver wire are by definition, replaceable. Not valuable. 

Guys that are valuable are cheap, young toolsy folks with upside. Someone you can grow into. And by young, I don't mean 26. Or even 25. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 338
  • Created
  • Last Reply
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, Frobby said:

The numbers say Mancini is a poor defensive LF, so this is a case of you overrating him, not everyone else underrating him.   He’s pretty sure handed but he’s slow and doesn’t get a great jump on the ball.

As to the pitchers in Delmarva, I’m somewhat optimistic, but we’ll see.   Delmarva is a long way from the majors.    Just look at how dominant Alex Wells was at Delmarva, compared to how average he’s been at Frederick.   

I don't trust the defensive numbers.  I think they get an impression on someone and they mark him accordingly.  They did it to Nick and Jones when he was younger.  What I see when I watch Mancini is a guy who catches most  everything he get to.  He covers ground well.  He is not swift like Mullins but he get to a lot of balls.  He dives and catches some.  His throwing has improved greatly this year over last year.   

I would rate him average and when I consider his offense he is a darn good player.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
weams Hangout Grand Counsel

weams

Posted
Posted
Just now, Tony-OH said:

Do you honestly think that was because of Joseph?

I don't honestly. Would cobb have been better with Sisco or Pena or Susac or Wynns catching? I don't know.  And I am the king of hyperbole. I did follow that up with "Tony likes him and I respect that."

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

Posted
  • Author
Posted
2 minutes ago, weams said:

I don't honestly. Would cobb have been better with Sisco or Pena or Susac or Wynns catching? I don't know.  And I am the king of hyperbole. I did follow that up with "Tony likes him and I respect that."

I understand that, but when you say things like look which game we won, that seems to indicate that the Orioles would have won with someone else other than Joseph in a game that they lost 10-3. So basically you are saying the team would be 8 runs better with another catcher. 

I like Joseph as much as anyone, but he is off to a slow start this year. He probably is a backup catcher on a good team, but I don't agree with people who say he's not a big league catcher.

BTW, over his last 12 games Jospeh is slashing .286/.306/.486/.791.

Sisco is slashing .206/.289/.441/.731 over his last 12, so let's not act like Sisco is killing it behind the plate an Joseph is an automatic out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Flaherty isn't a premium defender.

As for why they would trade him?  Because they had already signed Jose Bautista to play third.

Pretty stupid move by the Braves.   So Flaherty is a .222 career hitter who is so far this season hitting over .300.    The Braves go get Bautista who he is not hitting.   Probably will not hit. He is over.   And most every game he starts Flaherty replaces him defensively.    Flaherty is a better defender than Bautista.  The Braves didn't want to wait for Flaherty's hitting to drop off so they made a move.  So far it is not working.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, wildcard said:

Pretty stupid move by the Braves.   So Flaherty is a .222 career hitter who is so far this season hitting over .300.    The Braves go get Bautista who he is not hitting.   Probably will not hit. He is over.   And most every game he starts Flaherty replaces him defensively.    Flaherty is a better defender than Bautista.  The Braves didn't want to wait for Flaherty's hitting to drop off so they made a move.  So far it is not working.

Didn't Bautista hit a big HR recently?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
POR Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

POR

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't trust the defensive numbers.  I think they get an impression on someone and they mark him accordingly.  They did it to Nick and Jones when he was younger.  What I see when I watch Mancini is a guy who catches most  everything he get to.  He covers ground well.  He is not swift like Mullins but he get to a lot of balls.  He dives and catches some.  His throwing has improved greatly this year over last year.   

I would rate him average and when I consider his offense he is a darn good player.

So numbers are subjective?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Babypowder Hangout Veteran Council

Babypowder

Posted
Posted
25 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't trust the defensive numbers.  I think they get an impression on someone and they mark him accordingly.  They did it to Nick and Jones when he was younger.  What I see when I watch Mancini is a guy who catches most  everything he get to.  He covers ground well.  He is not swift like Mullins but he get to a lot of balls.  He dives and catches some.  His throwing has improved greatly this year over last year.   

I would rate him average and when I consider his offense he is a darn good player.

He's slow and his routes and jumps are both poor.

He's not good out there. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, POR said:

So numbers are subjective?

 

14 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Only when they disagree with your worldview.

Defensive numbers are based on small samples so they take longer to stabilize than offensive  numbers.     But in this case, my eyes agree with what the defensive  numbers are telling me.   To say he covers ground well simply isn’t accurate.   Of 41 left fielders who have played at least 100 innings in LF, Mancini rates 39th in range rate.   Honestly, I don’t think he’s that bad, but he has below average range, for sure.    

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Didn't Bautista hit a big HR recently?

The Braves beat the Marlin 10-5.  Bautista hit a sole homer in the 6th.  How big could it have been?  It was not a walk off  homer.  He is hitter 167 with a OPS in the 600s.      There is talk of  platooning Bautista with Flaherty and of course Falhery would be 3 times the at bats as the lefty handed batter.

https://www.mlb.com/braves/news/will-ryan-flaherty-platoon-with-jose-bautista/c-276299080

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Frobby said:

 

Defensive numbers are based on small samples so they take longer to stabilize than offensive  numbers.     But in this case, my eyes agree with what the defensive  numbers are telling me.   To say he covers ground well simply isn’t accurate.   Of 41 left fielders who have played at least 100 innings in LF, Mancini rates 39th in range rate.   Honestly, I don’t think he’s that bad, but he has below average range, for sure.    

That is not what I see.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

Posted
Posted
Just now, wildcard said:

The Braves beat the Marlin 10-5.  Bautista hit a sole homer in the 6th.  How big could it have been?  It was not a walk off  homer.  He is hitter 167 with a OPS in the 600s.      There is talk of  platooning Bautista with Flaherty and of course Falhery would be 3 times the at bats as the lefty handed batter.

https://www.mlb.com/braves/news/will-ryan-flaherty-platoon-with-jose-bautista/c-276299080

OK, it wasn't a big one.

And for the record I wouldn't have signed Bautista or put him at third base.

But it does show how unimpressed they are with Flaherty despite the hot start.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

OK, it wasn't a big one.

And for the record I wouldn't have signed Bautista or put him at third base.

But it does show how unimpressed they are with Flaherty despite the hot start.

Everyone is waiting for the Braves to fall in the standing including the Braves.   They don't believe that the Flaherty can out play his career numbers.   If they make other moves like that they will certainly make what everyone is waiting for happen.   if something is working for you ride it for as long as it lasts.

Oh, by the way,  Don't be surprised if Flaherty is back with the O's next year.   Not signing Flaherty looks like Dan trying to safe Buck from himself.   if Dan goes and Buck gets more control over personnel decisions, Flaherty could be back no matter how he hits in Atlanta.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing


  • Posts

    • SteveA
      Anyone tried the Immaculate Grid game?

      By SteveA · Posted

      Another successful all Oriole grid, 36 rarity points:
    • cboemmeljr
      AFL GAME SUMMARIES (ORIOLES PROSPECTS)

      By cboemmeljr · Posted

      GAME SUMMARY: 10/11/24
    • Warehouse
      The Difference between the O's and other Playoff teams

      By Warehouse · Posted

      He was allowed to face LHP.  My post wasn’t disagreeing with your post.  I was saying that not only did we let him face LHP, we let him do so despite not having much success against LHP.  I was pushing back against the narrative that we needlessly platooned Cowser.  Not only did we not platoon him, there is a reasonable argument that we should have platooned more than we did. We needed to play one of Mullins and Cowser in CF. Cowser mostly got the call vs. LHP because he was much better against LHP in the first half of the year, but this flipped in the second half.
    • Just Regular
      rWAR Year of birth leaders after 2024 - notable Orioles

      By Just Regular · Posted

      From Adley to Basallo, I think Elias has eight Bats I hope we get to see all take 600 PA simultaneously some season. Adley was born in 1998, and until he arrived Elias Orioles baseball was bad by design.    For flavor, leaders of those teams like 1994-1997 births Mullins, Santander, Hays and Mountcastle are all between 10th and 20th among bats born their year.   Your team might be drafting Jackson Holliday if they are your club's best players in a rebuild, unless you have great pitching, which...haha, we know Elias' game. MLB Baseball is mostly played by guys 24-32.    286 batters cleared 300 PA in 2024 - about 12% were 33 and up by Fangraphs seasonal age assignments, about 8% were 23 and down. This is just a once a year post, but looking at Bats born from Adley's 1998 to Basallo's 2004, here's how the Orioles achievements compare with MLB's best by rWAR. 1998 - Adley is 4th 1999 - Westburg is 9th, and Kjerstad is 33rd 2000 - Cowser is 16th 2001 - Gunnar is 1st, and Mayo is nearly last, having dug a deep hole in his initial PA.    Trivia - Darell Hernaiz one of the 3 beneath Mayo.    Noelvi Marte dead last also has a PED suspension, d'oh. 2003 - Holliday is 4th - Minnesota the last weekend he got himself out of negative WAR territory. 2004 - Basallo is n/a as Chourio alone has played MLB from that birth year.    Basallo did log the most high minors experience of the 2004 births during the 2024 season. In 2025, Gunnar enters the 24-32 range as Judge departs it.     Cowser's improvement after an off-season a story of comfort for Holliday and Mayo - can they approach his ~3.5 win contribution? Strong, young teams - doing this exercise highlighted Adley's Orioles a little younger than the Braves and all their famous contract extensions.    Acuna, Albies and Riley were all born the year before Adley.   On the AL side of the competition, Yordan and Kyle Tucker also 1997 holding up a strong competitor, though not one that is young anymore.     Judge and Gerrit hoping Soto please stays.    Soto from 1998 - you have to reach back to 1994 for Correa, Bregman and C. Seager to find anyone ahead of him.
    • Camden_yardbird
      Offseason Trade Pondering

      By Camden_yardbird · Posted

      The Orioles have a lot of flexibility both in terms of prospects, money and potential veterans that hold value. Vets - I could see the Orioles moving on from any of Mountcastle, Mullins, Urias, or O'Hearn. These players may hold the most potential to bullpen upgrades. Money - The Orioles will certainly spend this offseason and that more flexibility than they have had.  I would like to see 1 or 2 extensions, 1 high profile FA, and maybe 1 more solid addition. Prospects - I could see any of the big 4 going somewhere.  I really think the Orioles and Pirates match up really well.  The Pirates have a plethora of young pitchers and the Orioles have young hitters.  I wouldn't be surprised to see the two match up.
    • eddie83
      Co-hitting coach Ryan Fuller, Fredi Gonzalez and Jose Hernandez let go

      By eddie83 · Posted

      The hitting philosophy works. That’s why they have been winning the last two years.     Plenty of runs scoring off HR’s in the playoffs. 
    • DrinkinWithFermi
      Offseason Trade Pondering

      By DrinkinWithFermi · Posted

      They would probably want two of Mayo, Basallo, Holliday, and Kjerstad, plus other pieces (likely at least one good pitching prospect, so someone like Povich or McDermott), for both Crochet and Robert.

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...