Buck Has Seen Enough

[esmd]

On 5/18/2018 at 8:46 AM, birdwatcher55 said:

..and I've seen enough of Buck.

So, in your opinion, what manager out there could turn this turd into a playoff contender?  What manager could make Davis hit?  What manager can prevent injuries to Britton, Schoop, Beckham, and Trumbo?  What manager could somehow resurrect Tillman?  What manager could make Manny be willing to play 3B without raising hell?  What manager can turn back time to make Adam Jones a good CFer again and to keep him from fading at the plate?  What manager could've willed Alex Cobb to be ready to start in mid-April with virtually no spring training prep?

This franchise has a lot of problems right now, many of which are highlighted above, none of which Buck has any control over.  I suppose you could blame him for playing Manny at SS, but that strikes me as a lesser evil, because if Buck refused to move him, I think Manny would be a huge clubhouse cancer.  You can blame him for playing Davis regularly, but really, how can he not?  The owner paid $160M, they've got to do everything they can and then some to get some return on the investment.  No win scenario for Buck there.

Bottom line, the roster has gentrified, and they need to rebuild.  It remains to be seen if Buck is around for that, and in what capacity.

[spiritof66]

2 hours ago, tntoriole said:

Yes, I read Macht’s biography last year...outstanding!  Thanks. 

That's me -- always one step behind .  .  .  on my good days.

[esmd]

2 hours ago, ORIOLE33 said:

First, I’ll like to say that I have absolutely no problem with what Buck did. But I have to ask, if another manager did that to one of our players, would it be deemed as unclassy?

I don't know if unclassy is the right term, but it was definitely a faux paux, IMO.  Just a bad optic, and though I doubt he meant any disrespect to Bogarts, I would think it's something he'd like a do-over on.  Not his best moment.

[tntoriole]

1 hour ago, esmd said:

So, in your opinion, what manager out there could turn this turd into a playoff contender?  What manager could make Davis hit?  What manager can prevent injuries to Britton, Schoop, Beckham, and Trumbo?  What manager could somehow resurrect Tillman?  What manager could make Manny be willing to play 3B without raising hell?  What manager can turn back time to make Adam Jones a good CFer again and to keep him from fading at the plate?  What manager could've willed Alex Cobb to be ready to start in mid-April with virtually no spring training prep?

This franchise has a lot of problems right now, many of which are highlighted above, none of which Buck has any control over.  I suppose you could blame him for playing Manny at SS, but that strikes me as a lesser evil, because if Buck refused to move him, I think Manny would be a huge clubhouse cancer.  You can blame him for playing Davis regularly, but really, how can he not?  The owner paid $160M, they've got to do everything they can and then some to get some return on the investment.  No win scenario for Buck there.

Bottom line, the roster has gentrified, and they need to rebuild.  It remains to be seen if Buck is around for that, and in what capacity.

I think part of what removing Buck will accomplish is obviously removing whatever influence he also played in some of those very decisions that your point out.   Like signing Trumbo, influencing Angelos regarding Davis, wanting Tillman back, etc....JJ Hardy was responsible for Manny not having any real issues of playing third....that plus the reality that Manny knew he was a rookie (yes a talented rookie) but a rookie nonetheless, so it was easier to say, hey, we are not moving our All Star shortstop for you right now.  So you can decide to either wait in the minors for a while or come up here and play third.    Then there were the knee injuries which may have also dampened down any remaining tendency at the time Manny might have had of "raising hell" about not playing shortstop.     Buck did very, very well with the group that he had.  I have nothing but gratitude for the job he has done as skipper.    

But he also, in my opinion, had too much influence in the personnel selection process, much  more than many managers have.   And that we need to move on to new leadership, new decision makers for the next rebuild.   

[weams]

 

[weams]

4 hours ago, spiritof66 said:

I grew up in Philadelphia. My father was an A's fan, in his youth, and I started following baseball just a year or so after Connie Mack's death.  One of the first "adult" books I read,was Mack's 1950 autobiography, "My 66 Years in the Big Leagues." I must have read it 20 or 30 times, and still recall sections of it verbatim.

If you're really interested in Mack, Norman Macht's recent three-volume Mack biography is as much a history of  a large slice of baseball (and of late nineteenth and and first half of the twentieth century America) as the story of Connie Mack. It's a large time investment, but well worth it. 

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20151206_A_lifelong_mission_to_tell_Connie_Mack_s_story.html

"I'm not quitting because I'm getting old, I'm quitting because I think people want me to."

[NashLumber]

7 hours ago, spiritof66 said:

I grew up in Philadelphia. My father was an A's fan, in his youth, and I started following baseball just a year or so after Connie Mack's death.  One of the first "adult" books I read,was Mack's 1950 autobiography, "My 66 Years in the Big Leagues." I must have read it 20 or 30 times, and still recall sections of it verbatim.

If you're really interested in Mack, Norman Macht's recent three-volume Mack biography is as much a history of  a large slice of baseball (and of late nineteenth and and first half of the twentieth century America) as the story of Connie Mack. It's a large time investment, but well worth it. 

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20151206_A_lifelong_mission_to_tell_Connie_Mack_s_story.html

A fellow I knew pretty well in my childhood (his nephew is my first cousin and I worked on his tobacco farm several summers) was a pitcher for the Philadelpia A’s a few seasons and one of the last times I spoke to him, he told me he had Connie Mack’s signature on his first MLB contract. I asked him about some of the toughest batters he ever faced and he mentioned the ones I expected (Ted Williams, Mantle, a few other Yankees).