Grade the Rebuild, Phase I

[Mondo Trasho]

I voted A-/B+. I think they certainly could have gotten more (hypothetically) by trading earlier/later, and I think it might be a mistake to keep Bundy but trade Gausman. But, all things considered I think they made good decisions and decent trades.

The thing is though, the work is not finished, it's a start. If the effort isn't kept up to acquire and develop talent, we'll just be back here at some point. So whoever it is who ends up being the guy building the roster, they need to keep going.

[Grt 2BA FL Gator]

2 minutes ago, weams said:

Poor defense. Some power. Just a name. Someone they used to dream on. 

It makes sense what the Rays did, they are a little ahead of us in the rebuild and could want guys like that to rebound and contribute soon.

But to be honest, I didn't realize both Pirates guys had been in MLB and not successfully thus far. When they were discussed, everyone has mentioned their former prospect status and how great of a haul it was for Tampa. I think it was a fine haul. The guys have talent, but they've struggled at the major league level. 

[foxfield]

3 minutes ago, Grt 2BA FL Gator said:

Here's a question. How was Austin Meadows so highly thought of? Consensus top 10 prospect at one point. His minor league numbers look pretty average to me. I guess he had good half seasons when he was graduated in 2015/2016? And the pedigree of the 9th overall pick? But such SSS. 

Funny, I get it.  

Beckham was the #1 overall pick.  In 2007 Billy Rowell was the 52 rated prospect in all of baseball.  Consensus is not always right.  But that misses the point.  I'm not saying above that Archer and Glasnow are not  valuable.  Im simply refuting that trading for him and Glasnow are better than anything we got out of the 15 prospects.  There is a reason that the target was A and AA ballplayers.

 

 

[weams]

28 minutes ago, Grt 2BA FL Gator said:

It makes sense what the Rays did, they are a little ahead of us in the rebuild and could want guys like that to rebound and contribute soon.

But to be honest, I didn't realize both Pirates guys had been in MLB and not successfully thus far. When they were discussed, everyone has mentioned their former prospect status and how great of a haul it was for Tampa. I think it was a fine haul. The guys have talent, but they've struggled at the major league level. 

Austin is kinda successful In a Trey Mancini kind of way. 

[weams]

29 minutes ago, Mondo Trasho said:

I voted A-/B+. I think they certainly could have gotten more (hypothetically) by trading earlier/later, and I think it might be a mistake to keep Bundy but trade Gausman. But, all things considered I think they made good decisions and decent trades.

The thing is though, the work is not finished, it's a start. If the effort isn't kept up to acquire and develop talent, we'll just be back here at some point. So whoever it is who ends up being the guy building the roster, they need to keep going.

I don't think Bundy was ever a target at the deadline. Too much health question. He needs to pitch real well for a spell. 

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Cy Bundy said:

 

On to disgruntledport,

In the Yankee deal we got 3 guys that are 1-2 years younger than Schoop, in the Gausman deal we got 3 guys who are only 3 years younger than Schoop. 

Schoop is young enough to be part of a rebuild that doesn’t span more than a decade. 

Age is relevant but doesn’t factor in cost or years of control.    These guys may not be that much younger, but they’re way cheaper and we’ll control them for 6+ years.

Who knows, if the rebuild is making good progress by the end of the 2019 season, maybe we re-sign Schoop as a free agent.    

[maybenxtyr]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

1.   Mejia (to Indians): ranked 20, 11 and 5 by BA, MLB.com and BP, respectively going into 2018.

2.   Meadows (to Pirates): 44, 45, 34.

3.   Díaz (to Orioles): ranked 73 by BP going into 2018. 

4.   Glasgow (to Pirates): lost rookie status in 2017, but was ranked 23, 9 and 14 going into that season.   

Note: Diaz has been on a couple of mid season lists, and others’ rankings also may have changed. On MLB.com, Mejia was 21 and Diaz 57.  

Thanks for the list.

There really wasn't a lot of top high end guys moved when you consider how many tradee were made this year. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, maybenxtyr said:

Thanks for the list.

There really wasn't a lot of top high end guys moved when you consider how many tradee were made this year. 

Teams are becoming ever more reticent when it comes to trading high end prospects.

[weams]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Teams are becoming ever more reticent when it comes to trading high end prospects.

Unless they lost game seven of the World Series. 

[Frobby]

11 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Teams are becoming ever more reticent when it comes to trading high end prospects.

Kind’ve a buyer’s market this year because so many teams are out of it.

[NCRaven]

16 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Kind’ve a buyer’s market this year because so many teams are out of it.

Especially in the American League.

[foxfield]

12 minutes ago, Cy Bundy said:

Indisputably TB got two pieces back that are more valuable than any we received. We couldn’t traded Diaz for Glasnow or Meadows. It’s really not close.

So which is it again sir?  TB got two pieces worth more than any one of the 15 prospects?

Or they got two pieces worth more than all of the 15 prospects? 

I tell you what. I won’t argue but let’s do this. TB’s two studs Glasgow and Meadows will earn a certain amount of WAR for TB while under control.  I’ll take the WAR of the group the Orioles received for the amount of control the Orioles have. Would you care to wager which group is more valuable?  Or was there some other value you were referring to?

[Luke-OH]

It's a strong B for me due to not taking half measures and on most of the trades, they did better than other teams selling pieces did in comparable deals. 

I don't like the Gausman deal but it may have been necessary to clear salary, add international money to facilitate the rebuild.

I think the Orioles did quite well in the other moves, and are in a perfect position to add some high end talent with VVM and potentially other international pieces.

The only critique without knowing the team's finances (to be able to judge whether O'Day's salary should have been dumped) is that they didn't get as many high upside 18-20 year olds as I would have liked. The players they did get though are ones I like a lot. Even the non-headliners such as Kremer, Carroll, Pop, Bannon, and Carmona are all guys I think are nice pieces who may be underrated and on the upswing in value.

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, Luke-OH said:

It's a strong B for me due to not taking half measures and on most of the trades, they did better than other teams selling pieces did in comparable deals. 

I don't like the Gausman deal but it may have been necessary to clear salary, add international money to facilitate the rebuild.

I think the Orioles did quite well in the other moves, and are in a perfect position to add some high end talent with VVM and potentially other international pieces.

The only critique without knowing the team's finances (to be able to judge whether O'Day's salary should have been dumped) is that they didn't get as many high upside 18-20 year olds as I would have liked. The players they did get though are ones I like a lot. Even the non-headliners such as Kremer, Carroll, Pop, Bannon, and Carmona are all guys I think are nice pieces who may be underrated and on the upswing in value.

You aren't concerned that they put undue emphasis on players playing well this year?

[Luke-OH]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

You aren't concerned that they put undue emphasis on players playing well this year?

I would be if the tools didn't match the performance. It's not like they are grabbing guys getting by with smoke and mirrors. There is no Alex Wells in these deals, Evan Phillips (Phillips has a little more stuff than Meisinger but less deception, seems like he'll need above average command to be a decent relief arm) and Cumberland (I think his hit tool flaws are hidden by him playing at levels that are too low for him) are the two that I worry their performances are fluky, but I haven't watched enough game video yet to come to a conclusion.