Wins Leader By Season

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

If the player has a good chunk of input, Mussina isn't going in as an Oriole.

Hard to predict, the committee can be capricious.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

Hard to predict, the committee can be capricious.

Stop using big words.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Moose Milligan said:

Stop using big words.

Committee?

Would be a lot shorter if they hadn't doubled up on the M, the T and the E.

Comite.

[Frobby]

8 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

If the player has a good chunk of input, Mussina isn't going in as an Oriole.

Mussina has said several times that he wouldn’t want to have to choose.    I think he’ll let the HoF decide.

[Moose Milligan]

3 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Mussina has said several times that he wouldn’t want to have to choose.    I think he’ll let the HoF decide.

Welp, if that's the case I'm getting on the MFY.  

[TonySoprano]

More seasons, wins, higher win %, higher ERA+, 5 AS appearances - all in Baltimore.  Cito Sucks and Mussina should go into Cooperstown with an Orioles cap.

Jones won't make it into Cooperstown; Manny's gone.   It's going to be a very long time before another player makes the HOF as an Oriole.

[Dipper9]

1 hour ago, Redskins Rick said:

I dont even remember him, and he pitched here 5 years, I must be getting old.

I'm with you.  Jason Johnson?  

[weams]

7 hours ago, bobmc said:

Even when he is deemed only "very good" by one Mike Will?   er @weams

I think very good is very good myself. 

[El Gordo]

Be careful what you wish for. If he goes in as an O he could get a statue.

[Dipper9]

32 minutes ago, JohnBKistler said:

There are several of examples of players putting up most of their HOF stats on one team and then going in with another:  Dave Winfield, Nolan Ryan, Carlton Fisk.

Didn't Wade Bogs have it in Tampa's contract at the end of his career that he would go into the Hall as a Ray?  I don't think that happened though. 

[Dipper9]

8 minutes ago, TonySoprano said:

More seasons, wins, higher win %, higher ERA+, 5 AS appearances - all in Baltimore.  Cito Sucks and Mussina should go into Cooperstown with an Orioles cap.

Jones won't make it into Cooperstown; Manny's gone.   It's going to be a very long time before another player makes the HOF as an Oriole.

If Manny bounces around from team to team at 3 year pops, his Orioles career could still be longer than somewhere else.  

[Moose Milligan]

16 minutes ago, TonySoprano said:

More seasons, wins, higher win %, higher ERA+, 5 AS appearances - all in Baltimore.  Cito Sucks and Mussina should go into Cooperstown with an Orioles cap.

Let's agree to throw out the more seasons argument.  It's split practically down the middle.  Baseball reference says 10 years in Baltimore, 8 in NY, but that 10 in Baltimore includes 12 games he pitched in 1991.  It's more like 9 full seasons in Baltimore, 8 in NYC.  Big deal.  

Understood on the higher win %, higher ERA+, 5 AS appearances.  But way more postseason experience in NYC.  And if there's one thing that voters get giddy about, it's postseason experience.  It's why you hear some people say that Andy Pettite should be in the HoF.  Game 7 of the 1991 WS practically got Jack Morris in, without that there's no shot.  And Mussina was up and down in the postseason, I'm aware that he doesn't have a moment like Jack Morris did.  But he's got way more playoff experience as a Yankee.

But what you and @Tony-OH aren't looking at is money and exposure.  Cold, hard cash.  MLB stands to generate more interest in the HoF ceremony, celebrations, memorabilia sold and publicity  if Mussina goes in as a Yankee.  There's a good chunk of the Orioles fanbase that hates Mussina for going to the Yankees in the first place.  There's another chunk like me who doesn't really care.  I think there's a significantly smaller part of the fanbase that REALLY wants him in there and would go up and see the ceremony.  I bet members of this board went to go see Cal inducted, I doubt they'd go see Mussina get in.  

I don't even know how the Yankees fans feel about Mussina but it doesn't matter.  I doubt there's a large percentage of their fanbase that straight up hates him.  And they have a way bigger fanbase so they can drag their knuckles around Cooperstown all HoF weekend.  They'll buy merch, the YES network will talk about how great Mussina was, how he was part of teams that were in the playoffs (but didn't get a ring!) and on and on.  You guys can talk about wins, All-Star appearances, years spent in uniform as to why he should go in as an Oriole, I'm going to point to money, generating interest in the HoF and the Yankee machine as to why he goes in as a Yankee.

[Dipper9]

7 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Let's agree to throw out the more seasons argument.  It's split practically down the middle.  Baseball reference says 10 years in Baltimore, 8 in NY, but that 10 in Baltimore includes 12 games he pitched in 1991.  It's more like 9 full seasons in Baltimore, 8 in NYC.  Big deal.  

Understood on the higher win %, higher ERA+, 5 AS appearances.  But way more postseason experience in NYC.  And if there's one thing that voters get giddy about, it's postseason experience.  It's why you hear some people say that Andy Pettite should be in the HoF.  Game 7 of the 1991 WS practically got Jack Morris in, without that there's no shot.  And Mussina was up and down in the postseason, I'm aware that he doesn't have a moment like Jack Morris did.  But he's got way more playoff experience as a Yankee.

But what you and @Tony-OH aren't looking at is money and exposure.  Cold, hard cash.  MLB stands to generate more interest in the HoF ceremony, celebrations, memorabilia sold and publicity  if Mussina goes in as a Yankee.  There's a good chunk of the Orioles fanbase that hates Mussina for going to the Yankees in the first place.  There's another chunk like me who doesn't really care.  I think there's a significantly smaller part of the fanbase that REALLY wants him in there and would go up and see the ceremony.  I bet members of this board went to go see Cal inducted, I doubt they'd go see Mussina get in.  

I don't even know how the Yankees fans feel about Mussina but it doesn't matter.  I doubt there's a large percentage of their fanbase that straight up hates him.  And they have a way bigger fanbase so they can drag their knuckles around Cooperstown all HoF weekend.  They'll buy merch, the YES network will talk about how great Mussina was, how he was part of teams that were in the playoffs (but didn't get a ring!) and on and on.  You guys can talk about wins, All-Star appearances, years spent in uniform as to why he should go in as an Oriole, I'm going to point to money, generating interest in the HoF and the Yankee machine as to why he goes in as a Yankee.

Or maybe the Hall says..."Damn, these Birds have gone 35 years since a WS appearance, and haven't had a Hall of Famer since Cal and don't have any on the horizon, so let's throw them a bone."

[TonySoprano]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Let's agree to throw out the more seasons argument.  It's split practically down the middle.  Baseball reference says 10 years in Baltimore, 8 in NY, but that 10 in Baltimore includes 12 games he pitched in 1991.  It's more like 9 full seasons in Baltimore, 8 in NYC.  Big deal.  

Understood on the higher win %, higher ERA+, 5 AS appearances.  But way more postseason experience in NYC.  And if there's one thing that voters get giddy about, it's postseason experience.  It's why you hear some people say that Andy Pettite should be in the HoF.  Game 7 of the 1991 WS practically got Jack Morris in, without that there's no shot.  And Mussina was up and down in the postseason, I'm aware that he doesn't have a moment like Jack Morris did.  But he's got way more playoff experience as a Yankee.

But what you and @Tony-OH aren't looking at is money and exposure.  Cold, hard cash.  MLB stands to generate more interest in the HoF ceremony, celebrations, memorabilia sold and publicity  if Mussina goes in as a Yankee.  There's a good chunk of the Orioles fanbase that hates Mussina for going to the Yankees in the first place.  There's another chunk like me who doesn't really care.  I think there's a significantly smaller part of the fanbase that REALLY wants him in there and would go up and see the ceremony.  I bet members of this board went to go see Cal inducted, I doubt they'd go see Mussina get in.  

I don't even know how the Yankees fans feel about Mussina but it doesn't matter.  I doubt there's a large percentage of their fanbase that straight up hates him.  And they have a way bigger fanbase so they can drag their knuckles around Cooperstown all HoF weekend.  They'll buy merch, the YES network will talk about how great Mussina was, how he was part of teams that were in the playoffs (but didn't get a ring!) and on and on.  You guys can talk about wins, All-Star appearances, years spent in uniform as to why he should go in as an Oriole, I'm going to point to money, generating interest in the HoF and the Yankee machine as to why he goes in as a Yankee.

Zero World Series rings in NY.  They won the year before he arrived and the first year after he left,  so maybe the Hall will hold that against him.   I'm not ignoring the NY "money and exposure" nonsense so much as saying, "Oh look, another Yanker in the HOF.  Yawn."  They'll get Rivera and Captain Over-rated in back-to-back years, with the writers all mesmerized by the high voting percentages they'll get.  You tell me when Baltimore gets another chance at a HOFer
C'mon Cooperstown...

 

[NashLumber]

57 minutes ago, TonySoprano said:

Zero World Series rings in NY.  They won the year before he arrived and the first year after he left,  so maybe the Hall will hold that against him.   I'm not ignoring the NY "money and exposure" nonsense so much as saying, "Oh look, another Yanker in the HOF.  Yawn."  They'll get Rivera and Captain Over-rated in back-to-back years, with the writers all mesmerized by the high voting percentages they'll get.  You tell me when Baltimore gets another chance at a HOFer
C'mon Cooperstown...

 

Good points. And harkening back to earlier comments on Mussina having more noteworthy seasons regarding awards and in voting for such awards, it seems heavily tilted to his Baltimore years. Though he was in the postseason 7 straight years with the Yankees, he wasn’t as consistent of a vote getter from the “baseball minds” who decide such things (see far right column) in his NY years.