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The Victor Victor Mesa/Sandy Gaston thread

Luke-OH

By Luke-OH
in Orioles Talk

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Dark Helmet Hangout Grand Counsel

Dark Helmet

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

How many different ways do I have to say this before you understand?

A player whose talent level puts them outside the top 10 list of international prospects for a given year isn't going to have the talent to crack the top 10 in the draft as a HS student.

Even if you put him in a weak league in which he can dominate with a 100 MPH FB and nothing else.

 

You have no clue how he would do. Maybe a HS coach shows him another pitch.  If it's bugging you repeating yourself...stop wasting your time. 

 

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Dark Helmet Hangout Grand Counsel

Dark Helmet

Posted
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28 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

That WE HAVE A CLUE about what they are asking for.

Which you said we didn't have.

A clue does exist.

Not what each individual player is demanding we don't. 

And it's not like the Marlins HAVE to use the acquired pool money. Could be a juat in case. 

Who cares at this point. The Orioles probably get none of the three. 

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Dark Helmet Hangout Grand Counsel

Dark Helmet

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25 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

But we do have some clue.  Data points do exist.

Improperly using absolutes is one of my pet peeves.  ?

It wasn't an absolute. Can you for sure say Gaston wouldn't be a top pick out of high school throwing a 100mph but needing work on secondary pitches? Isn't that what minor league coaches are for?

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Just now, Dark Helmet said:

It wasn't an absolute. Can you for sure say Gaston wouldn't be a top pick out of high school throwing a 100mph but needing work on secondary pitches? Isn't that what minor league coaches are for?

I would say that we are not completely without knowledge.

Just because we can't rule it out doesn't mean we have "no clue".

For instance we know a right handed HS pitcher has never gone #1.  We have a fair idea what players are currently being looked at in the top 10 and can estimate how much Gaston would have to improve.

Those are clues.

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OsFanSinceThe80s Hangout Grand Counsel

OsFanSinceThe80s

Posted
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35 minutes ago, atomic said:

Also why Victor Victor is a bigger draw. He isn't 16 and you have a better idea of what you are getting.  Some 16 year old's are done growing. Some have barely started. 

Also good chance the 16 year old pitcher blows out his arm during the development process further delaying any chance at a MLB debut.

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jsbearr Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

jsbearr

Posted
Posted
20 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

He gets a "weird" message from a source he's not familiar with and he gets offended when folks question him?

If you want context on that tweet, then here it is.

A few folks were saying that by spending a ton on Mesas, Gaston, whoever that it shows international prospects that the Orioles are for real and will increase the Orioles ability to sign future prospects.  I replied that this is not really what happens.  Big money will sign players, yes.  But big money is transient.  What actually works when you are developing your network and fostering those relationships are not a history of big money, but that they trust you and the money you offer is not overwhelmed by anyone else throwing down an offer.  Signing a player for a lot of money simply does not move the needle when you look at future signings.

A couple commenters pushed back with thought exercises about what 15 year olds want in life. I told them that it simply is not how it works based on experiences communicated to me through people who have worked there for decades.  That got some snide remarks, so I then wrote OK nevermind the experiences and knowledge I have and am sharing with you all.  I do not know everything.  I am not an expert here, but I probably have a lot more experience than someone who is playacting a teenager. These are things that I have specifically engaged on and I feel incredibly confidant on that information. If the commenter can get yourself some primary sources who say otherwise, then that adds to the discussion.  If the foundation of the argument is that personal experience as a teenager is that it was fun to buy things, then I will disregard that as adding nothing to the conversation.

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