USAToday: Boras Quotes

[7Mo]

5 minutes ago, atomic said:

If you are purposely losing that is corruption. I agree with him.  I think the Orioles are in that boat. 

The O's aren't "purposely losing". They're allocating assets in other areas in order to build an organization for purposes of winning.

The alternative is to devote more assets to the MLB team, to "lose less now" but ensure that they're never rebuilt into an actual contender. 

[Aristotelian]

Could do a lottery system like the NBA. I'm not convinced it would change anything since the MLB draft is so unpredictable, but Boras is not wrong.

[eddie83]

1 hour ago, SteveA said:

A large % of casual fans seem, for some reason, to take a position of knee-jerk supporting of owners in a lot of these sports labor issues.   They don't like "greedy players" getting paid huge amounts of $ to play a kids game, and they associate that with rising ticket/concession/etc prices even though there is not much evidence that owners would lower prices rather than pocket the profit  if they could get a player for cheaper.

I'm not talking about sophisticated fans on here who understand the issues, how the system is structured, etc.   But we make up a very small % of the butts that are actually in the seats.    In just about every sports labor dispute I have been familiar with, there's been a lot of fan sentiment for management and against "greedy players".   

No doubt. To be honest this is how I was when I was younger. Then you wake up and realize the owners are making a ton of money and the players have a small window in time to make what they can. 

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

The idea is that more of them would side with the players if they were talking about guys in the minors having a living wage and guys who excelled in their first few years in the league making more than the minimum.

It's an easier argument to make than Adam Jones needs a multi-year deal.

Exactly, said it well here. The average fan complains about Chris Davis. They run with it and say how the players are overpaid.  

[Ohfan67]

There is no problem IMO. A higher percentage of teams are probably competitive for a postseason spot now that at almost anytime in baseball history. Some of the agents and writers were pointing fingers at Tampa for tanking last off-season. So much for their opinion. 

[eddie83]

16 minutes ago, 7Mo said:

The O's aren't "purposely losing". They're allocating assets in other areas in order to build an organization for purposes of winning.

The alternative is to devote more assets to the MLB team, to "lose less now" but ensure that they're never rebuilt into an actual contender. 

Atomic wants the Orioles to furnish the inside of a house with a roof that needs to be replaced. By the time the roof is fixed all the furniture and floors you spent money on will need to be replaced again as well. But it was a little bit nicer that brief time before the roof collapsed. 

The smart way is to wait until your roof is fixed before you furnish the house and then you get the most out of your investment.  

[spiritof66]

13 minutes ago, 7Mo said:

The O's aren't "purposely losing". They're allocating assets in other areas in order to build an organization for purposes of winning.

The alternative is to devote more assets to the MLB team, to "lose less now" but ensure that they're never rebuilt into an actual contender. 

Agreed. 

But to me the problem is this: when this approach to asset allocation seems to a bunch of teams like the best or only way to build a contender, isn't that bad for a sport that should be working hard to maintain current fans and attract new or returning ones?

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Could do a lottery system like the NBA. I'm not convinced it would change anything since the MLB draft is so unpredictable, but Boras is not wrong.

The lottery in the NBA sure stopped tanking.

[CallMeBrooksie]

11 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Could do a lottery system like the NBA. I'm not convinced it would change anything since the MLB draft is so unpredictable, but Boras is not wrong.

NBA's tanking problem is worse than MLB's. I don't think MLB has a tanking problem at all honestly. This is just Agents and Players Unions piggybacking on the NBA's problems to get a leg up in the upcoming negotiations.

There are more franchises being smart about rebuilding than ever before, but I don't think that's a bad thing in the long run.

[eddie83]

13 minutes ago, Ohfan67 said:

There is no problem IMO. A higher percentage of teams are probably competitive for a postseason spot now that at almost anytime in baseball history. Some of the agents and writers were pointing fingers at Tampa for tanking last off-season. So much for their opinion. 

This is what ticks me off. The Orioles, Royals and Tigers for the most part are the teams most discussed with tanking. I know there are others. 

Orioles

1998-2011 - 14 consecutive losing seasons. 

2012-16  3 playoff berths and no losing seasons

Royals 

1995-2012  - 17 of 18 losing seasons 

2013-15  - 3 consecutive winning seasons. Back to back AL Champs,  WS champs 

Tigers

1994-2005 12 consecutive losing seasons 

2006-2016  only 2 losing seasons  5 playoff berths, 2 WS appearances. 

It isn’t like these teams have been awful for years. What’s worse, being terrible in brief time periods or irrelevant for over a decade plus?

 

[Philip]

22 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Could do a lottery system like the NBA. I'm not convinced it would change anything since the MLB draft is so unpredictable, but Boras is not wrong.

I hate the lottery system because it doesn’t reward better teams. It’s just that if you’re not a playoff team you’re in the lottery. It doesn’t help at all, and only very rarely does the worst team actually get the first pick. Rewarding the best of the bad is much better than having a random choice event.

[atomic]

The league needs a salary floor and a draft lottery. That would solve these issues.  

[Sanfran327]

This is a dumb suggestion. The reason that there is no parity in baseball is because the draft is unpredictable and takes years to impact the big club and there's no salary cap. Tanking is really the only way to go, but not just for the draft picks. It goes all the way back to the Billy Beane comment that "you're either building for something special or you've got nothing," or something like that. Especially for us, there's no real sense in being in between. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Sanfran327 said:

This is a dumb suggestion. The reason that there is no parity in baseball is because the draft is unpredictable and takes years to impact the big club and there's no salary cap. Tanking is really the only way to go, but not just for the draft picks. It goes all the way back to the Billy Beane comment that "you're either building for something special or you've got nothing," or something like that. Especially for us, there's no real sense in being in between. 

That isn't true, it isn't the only way. 

[Philip]

5 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

This is what ticks me off. The Orioles, Royals and Tigers for the most part are the teams most discussed with tanking. I know there are others. 

Orioles

1998-2011 - 14 consecutive losing seasons. 

2012-16  3 playoff berths and no losing seasons

Royals 

1995-2012  - 17 of 18 losing seasons 

2013-15  - 3 consecutive winning seasons. Back to back AL Champs,  WS champs 

Tigers

1994-2005 12 consecutive losing seasons 

2006-2016  only 2 losing seasons  5 playoff berths, 2 WS appearances. 

It isn’t like these teams have been awful for years. What’s worse, being terrible in brief time periods or irrelevant for over a decade plus?

 

Thats irrelevant.  Any system that incentivizes losing should be changed. This suggestion incentivizes winning, without interfering with the concept of rebuilding through the draft. It just changes the parameters, instead of being the worst of 30 teams, you are the best of six out of that 30. That means you’re 24th. It creates an urgent incentive to not win 47 games.

[Sanfran327]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

That isn't true, it isn't the only way. 

Care to elaborate?

It's the only smart way, IMO. There is zero reason to invest in the major league team here right now. That leads to a bad team, lots of losses, and high draft picks. While still unpredictable, odds are at least better for higher picks.