Could Jahmai Jones be a better overall left fielder than Austin Hays?

[Yossarian]

Then the question becomes - How many outfielders do the Orioles keep?  Mullins, Santander, Hays, McKenna, Stewart,....... and now Jones?

[Yardball85]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

On its face it sounds like silly question.   Hays has been an outfield his whole professional career.   When healthy he can play any of the outfield positions  very well defensively.    Jones has been a 2B/CF in the minors.  Has barely played left field. So why is this even a question?

IMO Hays offense so far in the majors has not been good enough to hold down left field.   If what we have seen is all there is than he likely is a 4th outfielder.

His current numbers is  251/303/431/734 in 211 at bats

His career major league numbers are 262/312/427/ 739 in 461 at bats.

Outside of 68 at bats in 2019 he has not hit enough to hold down the left field position IMO.  This is NOT to say he can't get better.  He just turn 26 so there is still room to grow.  However his Righthanded/Lefthanded splits are not good for a everyday left fielder.

This season  vs righties 187/257/324/580 vs lefties 375/395/639/1034

Career     vs righties   252/309/358/706  vs lefties 288/320/495/816   

Kinda screams platoon guy.  But at just 26 its not written in stone that's where he will end up.  

So why  is Jahmai Jones even a consideration for left field.  Well, he appears to be a high error 2B who's bat is ready for a try in the majors.   He has played CF but from what I have read does not have the range to start there.  But maybe he has the range for left field.

Is 296/425/500/925 enough  to say that he should be the O's left field?  No,  but it might be enough to take a look at the major league level.

I could see some kind of a rotation working in the 2nd half where Hays plays left/center/right and Jones plays left/DH/2B.   During the dog days of summer it would be good to give Mountcastle/Mancini/Hays/Mullins and Santander days off.  This arrangement would do that.  It would take at bats away from Stewart but I don't see that as a problem at this point.

Why would the O's want to promote Jones instead of having him continue to play 2B at AAA?  The answer to that question depends on what the O's think for Terrin Varra.  If Vavra return from his back injury and continues to put up a 400 OBP and play better 2B than Jones then maybe Vavra needs to prove himself at AAA in the 2nd half.

Just saying'.   Maybe the competition would be good for everyone.  What do you think?

 

 

Good post.  It did seem silly at first, but there are some legs to it.  MY hope is that Hays improves with the bat and consistently OPS at or real close to .800, and Jones/Vavra battle it out for second base.

[wildcard]

10 minutes ago, Yossarian said:

Then the question becomes - How many outfielders do the Orioles keep?  Mullins, Santander, Hays, McKenna, Stewart,....... and now Jones?

For now I think Mullins, Santander and Hays stay.  McKenna need some more time at AAA IMO.   Stewart is about at the end of his rope the way I see it.   I don't know whether the O's would have him on the protected list over the winter.  I look for Elias to try to trade him for a A level prospect or even a International prospect.

Jones needs to come up in the near term IMO.

[Pickles]

I'd be shocked if Jones was even in  the same class as Hays defensively in LF.

Hays has played the best LF I can remember an Oriole doing in a long, long time.

[wildcard]

1 minute ago, Pickles said:

I'd be shocked if Jones was even in  the same class as Hays defensively in LF.

Hays has played the best LF I can remember an Oriole doing in a long, long time.

I agree defensively.   How about when considering offense and defense?

Both have good pedigrees.  Jones a 2nd rounder. Hays a 3rd rounder.   Jones 23.  Hays just turned 26.  I think there is room for both on the team.

[eddie83]

58 minutes ago, MurphDogg said:

I'm with Tony on Jones perhaps being a super-utility guy, but if he could be a starting second baseman that would be ideal.

I think you are selling the value of Hays' defense short if you don't think he is hitting well enough to be a corner outfielder. He is on nearly a 4 rWAR/162 games pace. An elite defensive leftfielder who is only a 100 OPS+ hitter still has a ton of value. As long as Hays is healthy, he is qualified to be a starting leftfielder for even a playoff bound team until the defense slips.

Whether he stays healthy is a big if, and you obviously can't rely on it until he proves he can, but he shouldn't be in any danger of losing his spot. Only Mullins has produced a higher rWAR this season among position players.

Yep. Hays’ glove is what makes him valuable. 
 

If Jones play the OF it should be at Santanders expense not Hays. 

[eddie83]

42 minutes ago, wildcard said:

For now I think Mullins, Santander and Hays stay.  McKenna need some more time at AAA IMO.   Stewart is about at the end of his rope the way I see it.   I don't know whether the O's would have him on the protected list over the winter.  I look for Elias to try to trade him for a A level prospect or even a International prospect.

Jones needs to come up in the near term IMO.

Jones will be up by end of July is my guess. I think DJ is running out of time as well.  

[Moose Milligan]

59 minutes ago, Yossarian said:

Then the question becomes - How many outfielders do the Orioles keep?  Mullins, Santander, Hays, McKenna, Stewart,....... and now Jones?

For now, Mullins is the only certainty.  And that remains to be seen...is it a ridiculously hot first half?  Can he do this again next year?

The rest of the guys are expendable.  Yes, even Hays.  None have stepped up to snatch a corner outfield spot to make it theirs.  Either poor performance, injury or both.

Throw Jones into the mix, see what happens.  

[wildcard]

11 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Yep. Hays’ glove is what makes him valuable. 
 

If Jones play the OF it should be at Santanders expense not Hays. 

Santander had a 773 OPS in 2019 and a 890 OPS in 2020.  He hasn't hit well this first half but what he has done in the last two seasons probably buys him some time to stay as a everyday outfielder IMO.

[SteveA]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

The O's young pitchers also need a good defensive 2B behind them.  So far that does not look like Jones.  And the O's are opening say he is not ready  to be a major league 2B.

What young pitchers?   We've got Spenser Watkins (28), Matt Harvey (32), Jorge Lopez (28), Thomas Eshelman (27), and Keegan Akin (26) in our rotation, with John Means (28) set to come off the IL and rejoin the rotation soon.

Dean Kremer is the only pitcher who hasn't turned 26 yet who has pitched more than 8.1 innings for us this season.

[MurphDogg]

4 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Santander had a 773 OPS in 2019 and a 890 OPS in 2020.  He hasn't hit well this first half but what he has done in the last two seasons probably buys him some time to stay as a everyday outfielder IMO.

Hays hitting as he is now is significantly more valuable than Santander with a .773 OPS.

You don't replace the guy that is more valuable now in the hopes that another guy starts performing significantly better than he has overall in his career. Chasing Santander's 2020 is foolish. If there is no other option, keep putting him out there, but don't replace your second most valuable position player instead of one who is playing at a replacement level.

[Tony-OH]

1 hour ago, Yossarian said:

Then the question becomes - How many outfielders do the Orioles keep?  Mullins, Santander, Hays, McKenna, Stewart,....... and now Jones?

I think we've seen enough of Stewart. He provide no defensive value and I think the bat will always be streaky but will never amount to anything worth his deficiencies in his defensive game. 

[eddie83]

Just now, wildcard said:

Santander had a 773 OPS in 2019 and a 890 OPS in 2020.  He hasn't hit well this first half but what he has done in the last two seasons probably buys him some time to stay as a everyday outfielder IMO.

I don’t think Jones has done anything to take at bats away from Hays. Santander isn’t healthy still. I could see them giving him some DH days over Hays. 
 

I’m all for the guy getting some at bats but you don’t take away playing time from Hays to accomplish it.  When he is healthy he needs to play. His upside is too high. 

[eddie83]

2 minutes ago, SteveA said:

What young pitchers?   We've got Spenser Watkins (28), Matt Harvey (32), Jorge Lopez (28), Thomas Eshelman (27), and Keegan Akin (26) in our rotation, with John Means (28) set to come off the IL and rejoin the rotation soon.

Dean Kremer is the only pitcher who hasn't turned 26 yet who has pitched more than 8.1 innings for us this season.

We have a huge hole at 2nd. 
 

In general I am not a fan of doing it but if there was ever a season to try someone at a position where they are limited it’s this year. 
 

The pitchers have holes all around them right now and as you say not exactly young guys up here. 

[Pickles]

35 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I agree defensively.   How about when considering offense and defense?

Both have good pedigrees.  Jones a 2nd rounder. Hays a 3rd rounder.   Jones 23.  Hays just turned 26.  I think there is room for both on the team.

There well may be room for both of them on the team going forward- a lot of that will depend on Jones' development- but there obviously isn't room for both in LF at the same time.

Nobody knows the future, and a rebuilding team should be keeping all its options open, but I believe that Hays is a significantly better "prospect" than Jones, particularly if limiting them to LF.