So... was the Cobb trade actually worth it?

[interloper]

First things first, I would agree with making this type of trade 10 times out of 10 considering where the O's were in their rebuild. Jettison a mediocre, aging starter and essentially pay for a former top prospect. Right? That's a thing rebuilding teams should do. Use that salary money for Cobb and get anything for him, in this case a young, mid-levelish MIF prospect in Jones who already cracked the big leagues. 

But I find myself wondering now after Jones' poor all around season in the minors and in his big league tryout if I might have just preferred Cobb throwing some quality-ish innings for the sake of stability. Of course that's total hindsight and like I said, there's not a lot of fault to be found for making this trade in the first place. But I expected Jones to show us... something. I mean he does not look like a ML player the same way Martin doesn't look like a ML player. So I guess I'm saying it's unfortunate we didn't get a better prospect, though I'm sure this is about as good as Elias could get for Cobb.

What are your thoughts? Is Jones anything? Should Elias have even targeted Jones in the first place? Would it have been worth more to the club and Hyde's overall health to simply keep Cobb? 

[oriole]

Unfortunately there was no market for Cobb and at the time, Jones seemed like a great player to get in return. After actually watching him…let’s just say I’d be surprised if he is on the next winning team. But at the end of the day it was still worth the trade IMO. We knew what we’d be getting in Cobb and it wasn’t particularly good so they rolled the dice a little and lost. No reason to feel remorseful though. 

[interloper]

1 minute ago, oriole said:

Unfortunately there was no market for Cobb and at the time, Jones seemed like a great player to get in return. After actually watching him…let’s just say I’d be surprised if he is on the next winning team. But at the end of the day it was still worth the trade IMO. We knew what we’d be getting in Cobb and it wasn’t particularly good so they rolled the dice a little and lost. No reason to feel remorseful though. 

Yeah, this is about how I feel. Jones is kind of the epitome of a dice roll move. At the very least we have a younger guy under control who can compete for a job out of ST. Who knows, maybe something clicks. 

Also, maybe we don't get that #1 pick with Cobb pitching.

[jabba72]

6 minutes ago, interloper said:

Yeah, this is about how I feel. Jones is kind of the epitome of a dice roll move. At the very least we have a younger guy under control who can compete for a job out of ST. Who knows, maybe something clicks. 

Also, maybe we don't get that #1 pick with Cobb pitching.

Thats a good point. Otherwise no I dont think the return was worth it. Saved $5m and got back Jones.

[MurphDogg]

I certainly am not going to judge Jones on 72 plate appearances spread out over the last 39 games of the season. 

Interestingly, the Orioles were 11-8 in the games that Jones started.

He was solid but not spectacular at AAA, with an OPS 80 points higher than the team average and a very good 94 point delta between his batting average and OBP.

Hopefully he will get the chance to play every day next year (most likely in AAA) and I imagine his defensive position may be a little more settled. Need to know whether he is going to be a super utility guy or a potential everyday second baseman, hopefully by the end of Spring Training, we will have an answer as to which way the team is leaning.

[Frobby]

If Jones does not turn into anything useful, I’d call this a minor loser for the Orioles.   They only saved $5 mm in the trade (they agreed to pay $10 mm of Cobb’s 2021 salary), and Cobb pitched well in 93 innings of work.   So, I’d say we lost some value, but all that value would have gotten us is a few more wins in 2021.    So, no biggie.    

I haven’t written Jones off yet based on his limited stint with the Orioles this year, but I’ll be surprised if he amounts to much as a big leaguer.   
 

[Aristotelian]

Yes, we got the Angels to take some of the money so it was worth it regardless of what Jones does. 

[Moose Milligan]

Kind of a wash.  I mean, it's a minor trade, one that happens and has to happen for a franchise.  But it doesn't really move the needle.  

You guys are being too kind to Jones, IMO.  He'll be lucky if he sticks as a backup infielder somewhere, that appears to be his ceiling from where I'm sitting.  

[Jammer7]

Lost in this trade was the opportunity to evaluate our young starters. But, Kremer and Akin regressed, Zimm was injured, Baumann injured, Lowther and Wells got the yo-yo treatment, and Pitching Coach Chris Holt disappeared for a month.

Jones hit well for about two months before struggling after an injury. He likely isn’t an average defender at 2B, but he is not awful. I still believe he will hit.

[HowAboutThat]

1 hour ago, interloper said:

First things first, I would agree with making this type of trade 10 times out of 10 considering where the O's were in their rebuild. Jettison a mediocre, aging starter and essentially pay for a former top prospect. Right? That's a thing rebuilding teams should do. Use that salary money for Cobb and get anything for him, in this case a young, mid-levelish MIF prospect in Jones who already cracked the big leagues. 

But I find myself wondering now after Jones' poor all around season in the minors and in his big league tryout if I might have just preferred Cobb throwing some quality-ish innings for the sake of stability. Of course that's total hindsight and like I said, there's not a lot of fault to be found for making this trade in the first place. But I expected Jones to show us... something. I mean he does not look like a ML player the same way Martin doesn't look like a ML player. So I guess I'm saying it's unfortunate we didn't get a better prospect, though I'm sure this is about as good as Elias could get for Cobb.

What are your thoughts? Is Jones anything? Should Elias have even targeted Jones in the first place? Would it have been worth more to the club and Hyde's overall health to simply keep Cobb? 

Jones is nothing, but it was still a good try, because we didn’t know that he would be nothing. You make that trade seven days a week and twice on Sundays.

Meanwhile, Martin can’t hit, but he’s a better defender than Jones. I saw Jones multiple times make throws on routine plays  that were so lazy the runner almost beat them out. I don’t know if he was underestimating the speed of the runner, he was being complacent, or he just doesn’t have a good throwing arm. 

[Ripken]

1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

You guys are being too kind to Jones, IMO.  He'll be lucky if he sticks as a backup infielder somewhere, that appears to be his ceiling from where I'm sitting.  

Those guys can play defense.

 

[Moose Milligan]

7 minutes ago, Ripken said:

Those guys can play defense.

 

I guess they can.  I don't think Jones did that exceptionally well, though.  

[HowAboutThat]

 Even with the caveat of short sample size, his defense was pretty lousy. I’m going to see if I can find some video of the throws that I was referencing. It’s worth mentioning that Valaika  threw lazy, too.

I watched highlights of the 2016 wildcard game against the Blue Jays, and those highlights, which on the oriole side were mainly Defense, Really illustrate not just how good they were on defense, But how terrible the team is now, and apparently how little the fans are willing to accept.

[LookinUp]

We saved money and got the #1 pick in the draft. You only think this was a bad trade if you're against the tanking. I'm ok with tanking because it'll help us get better guys in the future that are not directly part of any trade.

 

[HowAboutThat]

I HATE tanking. Very little infuriates me more than BS about, “we’re not focusing on wins right now.”

On the other hand, we could be the Padres fans