Gold Glove Finalists being announced -- Urias at 3B, Cedric in CF, but no Mateo or Adley

[DrungoHazewood]

14 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

I just don't think you give GMs enough credit.

I don't think a single GM is going to give more in trade because a player finished as a GG finalist in 2022.

To believe that a GG nomination would raise a player's trade value you'd have to think that some major league GMs have much less knowledge about baseball than 25 people currently active on Orioles Hangout.  We're smart bunch of dudes but... no.

[waroriole]

9 hours ago, Frobby said:

There’s a decent case to be made that Trevino, Raleigh and Murphy were more deserving than Adley.  Fangraphs has all three ranked above Adley.  All three rank above Adley in Rtot.   Two of the three rank higher in Rdrs.  I’m not going to argue that Adley was robbed.  He had a good case, but so did the three who got nominated.   Next year when Adley has a full season, he’ll have another shot.  

Ok that’s fair with Adley.  I just assumed he was at the top of defensive metrics, but see he’s closer to the middle of the pack than the top of it. 

[DrungoHazewood]

47 minutes ago, waroriole said:

Ok that’s fair with Adley.  I just assumed he was at the top of defensive metrics, but see he’s closer to the middle of the pack than the top of it. 

And nine runs of Rutschman's defensive value come from framing.  I don't know how many voters realize that, but some who do are probably skeptical. I think that's real for now, some don't.

[Frobby]

2 hours ago, waroriole said:

Ok that’s fair with Adley.  I just assumed he was at the top of defensive metrics, but see he’s closer to the middle of the pack than the top of it. 

Well, I’d still call him near the top of the pack.  I’m just saying these other guys had a good case, too.

One thing I find interesting is that while his CS% wasn’t anything amazing (31%, slightly above league average of 25%), runners did not test him very often.  He allowed a stolen base only once every 30 innings caught.   By comparison, Raleigh was once every 18 innings, Murphy once every 24 innings, Trevino once every 27 innings.  

I think what probably hurt Adley was (1) fewer innings than the other three, due to missing the first quarter of the season, and (2) 8 errors, tied for the league lead.   His arm was a bit erratic at first, and I believe all three of his non-throwing errors were on catcher’s interference.   

Overall, no complaints at all about Adley’s defense, and with experience he should even be better going forward.  

 

[NashLumber]

Being snubbed for awards like this can sometimes be a motivating factor to prove the "powers that be" wrong the next time a player suits up. I kind of see Mateo being affected this way (seems more emotional, like with calls at the plate) than Adley. Adley seems more stoic. 

I remember Tom Burleson being overlooked for the ACC First Team in '74 and he went on to have stellar performances in the ACC and NCAA tournament. 

Of course, I'm sure it feels better in the short run (and in the long layoff till spring) to be at least nominated. 

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by NashLumber

[LA2]

On 10/20/2022 at 7:14 PM, Sports Guy said:

Soto being on there is atrocious 

As has been amply proven in the current round of the playoffs. San Diego must be glad they are under no contractual obligation to Soto and Bell after this season (as far as I can tell). I have no idea of how good the prospects are that the Padres gave up in exchange for the underperforming pair. Luke Voit, whom Bell replaced in the Padres lineup, has outperformed him since the trade (95 to 75 OPS+). I wish Darvish was an Oriole.

[Can_of_corn]

9 minutes ago, LA2 said:

As has been amply proven in the current round of the playoffs. San Diego must be glad they are under no contractual obligation to Soto and Bell after this season (as far as I can tell). I have no idea of how good the prospects are that the Padres gave up in exchange for the underperforming pair. Luke Voit, whom Bell replaced in the Padres lineup, has outperformed him since the trade (95 to 75 OPS+). I wish Darvish was an Oriole.

It's funny to me how folks are ripping on Soto.

Dude still put up a 5.6 Win season with an OPS+ of 149, even in a "down" year.

 

[LA2]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

It's funny to me how folks are ripping on Soto.

Dude still put up a 5.6 Win season with an OPS+ of 149, even in a "down" year.

 

He's got a nice OBP with the Padres and only grounded into one double play!

[SteveA]

18 minutes ago, LA2 said:

As has been amply proven in the current round of the playoffs. San Diego must be glad they are under no contractual obligation to Soto and Bell after this season (as far as I can tell). I have no idea of how good the prospects are that the Padres gave up in exchange for the underperforming pair. Luke Voit, whom Bell replaced in the Padres lineup, has outperformed him since the trade (95 to 75 OPS+). I wish Darvish was an Oriole.

Soto doesn't hit free agnecy for at least two more years.   Are you suggesting they might non-tender him??    That would be shocking.

[sevastras]

14 hours ago, SteveA said:

Soto doesn't hit free agnecy for at least two more years.   Are you suggesting they might non-tender him??    That would be shocking.

Absolutely zero chance they gave up what they did for half a year. I wouldn’t have given up what they did for 2.5 years BUT, hard to see them extending him with Mannys and Tatis contracts. Quite possibly, but they would have over $100mm a year tied up with three players. 
Maybe they can trade Tatis to the Nats and get Hassell and Abrams back. 

[DrungoHazewood]

20 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

It's funny to me how folks are ripping on Soto.

Dude still put up a 5.6 Win season with an OPS+ of 149, even in a "down" year.

 

He's a different player if he's going to hit .240. Obviously still very productive, but interesting to see how much of his 80 point drop in BABIP this was luck, how much was shifts, and how much was not hitting the ball as well.  Most of his Statcast numbers don't look too different this year, but his xBA is well off 2020-21 for some reason.

It might just be like Hank Aaron in '60, when he went from hitting .355 in 1959 to .290.  He was okay.

[Number5]

On 10/20/2022 at 3:50 PM, Just Regular said:

Bogus.

 

Upon further consideration, they have decided to give the GG to Derek Jeter.

[Spy Fox]

We aren't the only ones that noticed. Fangraphs: Jorge Mateo Deserved A Gold Glove.

The analysis was similar to Frobby's earlier in the thread showing Mateo's high rankings across the various defensive metrics for SS, with a clear conclusion:

Quote

According to several of the best measurements we have, Mateo was far and away the top fielding shortstop in the AL. Overall, his defensive stat line was unparalleled. If the Gold Gloves are truly meant to honor the best defenders at each position, then he deserved to have won for his performance this year.

 

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Spy Fox said:

We aren't the only ones that noticed. Fangraphs: Jorge Mateo Deserved A Gold Glove.

The analysis was similar to Frobby's earlier in the thread showing Mateo's high rankings across the various defensive metrics for SS, with a clear conclusion:

 

That’s a well argued article.   It’s a joke that Mateo wasn’t even nominated.  

[RZNJ]

Nice article in Fangraphs on Mateo.

 

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/jorge-mateo-deserved-a-gold-glove/