2023 Ongoing Lineup Thread

[Sanity Check]

5 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

When you are starting two guys with a sub .560 OPS for the month of July in Mateo and .563 OPS for the year in McCann, that's sigh worthy.  One I can see, but both at the same time shouldn't happen.  

So, Rutschman is getting the day off, which he deserves.  Which of these guys on the bench would you start in Mateo's or McCann's place?  Serious question.....Cowser, Frazier, or O'Hearn?  There's only one logical answer, and even that is not a good one.

[Sanity Check]

Just doing my part here to keep the negative momentum, but this is not  a competitive lineup in any way shape or form.  Westburg 5th?  And Henderson against a lefty?  And everyone else being right handed against the lefty??  Prepare to be shut out folks, this just won't cut it.

(reverse jinx now in effect).... 

[forphase1]

5 minutes ago, Sanity Check said:

So, Rutschman is getting the day off, which he deserves.  Which of these guys on the bench would you start in Mateo's or McCann's place?  Serious question.....Cowser, Frazier, or O'Hearn?  There's only one logical answer, and even that is not a good one.

I don't like Frazier, but I'd rather see him in the lineup than Mateo.  But I'd be more inclined to not DH Henderson, have him at SS and DH O'Hearn (.873 OPS against LHP in limited chances) or Cowser (bad numbers no doubt, but he needs at bats to get 'right', and at least there is a chance there IMO, unlike Mateo).  

As I've said, Mateo should NEVER start, and should only be an emergency replacement/defensive sub if needed/pinch runner.  His bat is just that bad AND his defense isn't nearly as good as last year.  Obviously Hyde (or whoever all has input in the lineup) doesn't agree, but numbers show Mateo simply isn't good, and hasn't been quite a while, even though he's had a good couple moments here and there.  As they say, even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then...even a terrible Mateo will get a bit hit or play on occasion.  

[Aristotelian]

5 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

I don't like Frazier, but I'd rather see him in the lineup than Mateo.  But I'd be more inclined to not DH Henderson, have him at SS and DH O'Hearn (.873 OPS against LHP in limited chances) or Cowser (bad numbers no doubt, but he needs at bats to get 'right', and at least there is a chance there IMO, unlike Mateo).  

As I've said, Mateo should NEVER start, and should only be an emergency replacement/defensive sub if needed/pinch runner.  His bat is just that bad AND his defense isn't nearly as good as last year.  Obviously Hyde (or whoever all has input in the lineup) doesn't agree, but numbers show Mateo simply isn't good, and hasn't been quite a while, even though he's had a good couple moments here and there.  As they say, even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then...even a terrible Mateo will get a bit hit or play on occasion.  

Frazier is terrible defensively, by far the worst on the team. His bat isn't that much better than Mateo, particularly vs LHP. I have no problem with Mateo if they want to give Gunnar a DH-rest day. 

[EddeeEddee]

3 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

I don't like Frazier, but I'd rather see him in the lineup than Mateo.  But I'd be more inclined to not DH Henderson, have him at SS and DH O'Hearn (.873 OPS against LHP in limited chances) or Cowser (bad numbers no doubt, but he needs at bats to get 'right', and at least there is a chance there IMO, unlike Mateo).  

As I've said, Mateo should NEVER start, and should only be an emergency replacement/defensive sub if needed/pinch runner.  His bat is just that bad AND his defense isn't nearly as good as last year.  Obviously Hyde (or whoever all has input in the lineup) doesn't agree, but numbers show Mateo simply isn't good, and hasn't been quite a while, even though he's had a good couple moments here and there.  As they say, even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then...even a terrible Mateo will get a bit hit or play on occasion.  

Mateo has good numbers against lefties.  As a hitter he's a presumably platoon player from now on.

[Sanity Check]

11 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

I don't like Frazier, but I'd rather see him in the lineup than Mateo.  But I'd be more inclined to not DH Henderson, have him at SS and DH O'Hearn (.873 OPS against LHP in limited chances) or Cowser (bad numbers no doubt, but he needs at bats to get 'right', and at least there is a chance there IMO, unlike Mateo).  

As I've said, Mateo should NEVER start, and should only be an emergency replacement/defensive sub if needed/pinch runner.  His bat is just that bad AND his defense isn't nearly as good as last year.  Obviously Hyde (or whoever all has input in the lineup) doesn't agree, but numbers show Mateo simply isn't good, and hasn't been quite a while, even though he's had a good couple moments here and there.  As they say, even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then...even a terrible Mateo will get a bit hit or play on occasion.  

Fair enough, and even though Mateo's defense is allegedly not as good as last year, he's still pretty darn good this year.  It's not like he's "bad."

[webbrick2010]

Time for Ortiz to replace Mateo, hoping Mateo is a throw in on a larger trade to bring a Dylan Cease and/or David Robertson type pitcher

[Frobby]

The top 3 hitters in the Phillies’ lineup are making more money than the entire Orioles team combined.  

[SteveA]

8 minutes ago, Frobby said:

The top 3 hitters in the Phillies’ lineup are making more money than the entire Orioles team combined.  

And their OPS+s are 102, 89, 118 (adds up to 309).

Our first 3 batters OPS+s, even including Mountcastle, are 122, 127, 91 (adds up to 340).

[Billy F-Face3]

1 hour ago, Sanity Check said:

 Which of these guys on the bench would you start in Mateo's 

Defensively, I was thinking along the lines of starting...

C McCann

3B Urias

SS Henderson

2B Westburg

1B Mountcastle 

LF Hays

CF Hicks

RF Santander

DH Rutschman or O'Hearn 

I think that provides a decent defense without sacrificing the bottom of the lineup to a hope and a prayer. 

Obviously if Adley is getting a total day off (which I understand) he wouldn't be able to DH, so then the DH would default to O'Hearn who can't really be judged against LHP because he hasn't been given much of an opportunity, but he has been hot lately and he just hit a home run against a lefty yesterday. He's been our most clutch hitter recently so I'd play him.

[Brooks The Great]

I think Hicks is in the beginning of a dreadful slump where he'll become unplayable, and then Hyde will finally start treating him like the 4th OF that Hicks is barely good enough to be in the first place. Hyde is just a prisoner of recency and showing favoritism towards mediocre vets. 

I want to see a Hays/Cowser/Santander OF every day until Ced comes back. Cowser WILL start to hit eventually. And when he does, he'll be tough for pitchers to get out. 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Brooks The Great

[accinfo]

2 minutes ago, Brooks The Great said:

Hyde is just a prisoner of recency and showing favoritism towards mediocre vets. 

 

That "prisoner" has the Orioles with the best record in the AL going into their 100 game.  It would be amazing to see the Orioles record if we didn't see all these bad decisions. 

[SteveA]

6 minutes ago, Brooks The Great said:

I think Hicks is in the beginning of a dreadful slump where he'll become unplayable, and then Hyde will finally start treating him like the 4th OF that Hicks is barely good enough to be in the first place. Hyde is just a prisoner of recency and showing favoritism towards mediocre vets. 

I want to see a Hays/Cowser/Santander OF every day until Ced comes back. Cowser WILL start to hit eventually. And when he does, he'll be tough for pitchers to get out. 

If Mullins wasn't on the IL, or if Cowser had done anything at the plate, Hicks would be playing less than he is right now.   Hyde isn't a prisoner of anything.   Cowser has started 6 straight games when we have faced a righty pitcher, and 10 of 13 games vs a righty since he has been up.

Edited July 24, 2023 by SteveA

[Alasdaire]

Really would be nice if they called another guy up and let one of them plus Cowser/Westburg prove which deserves playing time come playoff time. I think the coaches will default to the veterans in the playoffs if the rookies don't do something to prove it, but I don't want Jorge Mateo/Adam Frazier playing in the playoffs, so call up another prospect or two now to increase the chances you find one of them with a higher ceiling than Mateo/Frazier by playoff time.

[Brooks The Great]

3 hours ago, SteveA said:

If Mullins wasn't on the IL, or if Cowser had done anything at the plate, Hicks would be playing less than he is right now.   Hyde isn't a prisoner of anything.   Cowser has started 6 straight games when we have faced a righty pitcher, and 10 of 13 games vs a righty since he has been up.

Cowser should be playing every day. He's a better talent than Hicks. He hit lefties well this year in the minors. 

Both Westburg and Cowser helped win the game today - both guys who haven't played as much as they should since coming up, and both guys who are big parts of this team's long-term future.

Hyde has managed them poorly and is lucky to have so much talent at his disposal.