What about Mayo?

[Say O!]

We know the kid will hit, but how has his defense looked at 3B?  Any early reports from camp?

[DirtyBird]

25 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

It doesn't really matter if you're enthusiastic about it or not.  Elias has come right out about the plan for Mateo and it doesn't take to much detective work to see how they hope to use Kjerstad. 

I’m not sure where you are getting this from when Elias’s only comment was that Mateo will get more reps at CF this spring. That does not mean he will be the backup CF.

I would bet Cowser gets double the starts at CF than Mateo. Hays might get more starts than Mateo there too, and he only started 5 games there last season.

[Sydnor]

24 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

It's simple, IMO.  Every at bat that Mateo gets is blocking a more talented hitter from getting said at bat.  Whether we are talking blocking Westburg as a utility infielder subbing in for the starting 3 of Holliday, Henderson and Mayo (the lineup I'd love to see with Westburg starting 4+ times a week subbing in for one of them, and shuffling things around), or starting SS frequently because Mayo and Holliday are left in AAA again, etc., regardless it's taking away at bats that could be used for a better hitter.  

The problem, for me at least, is that I have yet to see ANY evidence that Hyde/Elias will use Mateo as you suggest.  If he was TRULY just a 2nd utility infielder, fifth outfielder or a pinch runner, then I wouldn't mind nearly so much him being on the team.  Getting a spot start here and there, and pinch running in key situations, but otherwise riding the pine.  But he won't be used that way.  Even late last year, when his bat had cratered, his defense had drastically slipped and he wasn't nearly as impactful on the basepaths, he still started a 1/3rd of the games.  We have talented hitters who need at bats, and every at bat Mateo takes is an opportunity lost that either 1) a better hitter could have gotten or 2) a more talented hitter who needs experience against MLB pitching could have gotten.  

My counter argument here would be that the team is very different now. They were platooning Frazier at second. So Mateo would start at SS, Gunnar at 3rd, and Westburg at 2nd (Urias had a heel injury last August IIRC). When Mayo arrives, you don’t need to platoon him against left handed pitchers. They might initially platoon Holliday a bit, but if they do, I would imagine that it won’t happen for a long period provided that he hits as projected. Moreover, I would think that Urias would be the platoon partner. I could be wrong, but the idea of using Mateo in the outfield seems to be a way to justify keeping him to be the 26th man on the roster, and I would expect him to be used in that manner barring injury issues.

[RZNJ]

28 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

I’m not sure where you are getting this from when Elias’s only comment was that Mateo will get more reps at CF this spring. That does not mean he will be the backup CF.

I would bet Cowser gets double the starts at CF than Mateo. Hays might get more starts than Mateo there too, and he only started 5 games there last season.

I’ve already explained what I think the plan is.  I don’t guarantee that it happens.  Let me do it one more time.  Mateo being able to backup CF allows the Orioles to carry another outfielder who isn’t someone you want playing CF.  That’s Kjerstad.   Assuming Holliday, Henderson, and Westburg are the starters and O’Hearn is on the team that leaves 4 bench spots.  McCann is a lock.  3 to go.  Urias backs up 2B and 3B.  2 to go.  Who you got?   

[forphase1]

19 minutes ago, Sydnor said:

My counter argument here would be that the team is very different now. They were platooning Frazier at second. So Mateo would start at SS, Gunnar at 3rd, and Westburg at 2nd (Urias had a heel injury last August IIRC). When Mayo arrives, you don’t need to platoon him against left handed pitchers. They might initially platoon Holliday a bit, but if they do, I would imagine that it won’t happen for a long period provided that he hits as projected. Moreover, I would think that Urias would be the platoon partner. I could be wrong, but the idea of using Mateo in the outfield seems to be a way to justify keeping him to be the 26th man on the roster, and I would expect him to be used in that manner barring injury issues.

But that's part of my point I guess. Why are they going out of their way to justify keeping him on the roster?  He just isn't good enough to twist yourself into knots trying to keep him on the roster.  I'd rather see a Cowser or Kjerstad or someone like that in that roster spot 

I hope you are right,  and that because the team is different now his use will be less.  Again,  if he's really just a role player then I don't mind him being on the team.   Just the way they used him last year and the glowing way he's been talked about this spring ( I know it's just talk,  but still) makes me fearful he's going to get much more playing time than his bat can really justify.  Because I don't trust Hyde (or whomever makes those decisions) to not play him frequently, I'd rather him be off of the roster entirely than be kept and used too much.   

In the end it'll come down to how he's actually used.   If he only gets 150 at bats then no,  he didn't much block anyone and I wouldn't want one if the young guys getting that little playing time.   But if he gets 250-300 at bats,  then he was used way too often and someone better should have been in his spot.

[BohKnowsBmore]

1 hour ago, Say O! said:

We know the kid will hit, but how has his defense looked at 3B?  Any early reports from camp?

You've sure got some nerve talking about Coby Mayo in this thread...

[DirtyBird]

6 hours ago, RZNJ said:

I’ve already explained what I think the plan is.  I don’t guarantee that it happens.  Let me do it one more time.  Mateo being able to backup CF allows the Orioles to carry another outfielder who isn’t someone you want playing CF.  That’s Kjerstad.   Assuming Holliday, Henderson, and Westburg are the starters and O’Hearn is on the team that leaves 4 bench spots.  McCann is a lock.  3 to go.  Urias backs up 2B and 3B.  2 to go.  Who you got?   

Yes, you have tried to state what you think will happen as fact, and what management wants to happen. You have manipulated quotes to do this.

”we will give Jackson every opportunity to make the club” does not mean Jackson will make the club.

”we will get Mateo reps in CF” does not mean they have Mateo penciled in for the season plans at CF, especially since he hasn’t been used in games there.

And there is zero indication that Kjerstad is more likely to make the team than Cowser.

[Roll Tide]

9 hours ago, Pickles said:

Why TF would you "purge" a roster that's coming off 101 wins?

Like what's the mentality behind that?

Because you have better players than Urias, Mateo, McKenna, … obviously I’m not suggesting we move a long the core. Just too make room for the the guys that should be here.

[Jagwar]

7 hours ago, RZNJ said:

It doesn't really matter if you're enthusiastic about it or not.  Elias has come right out about the plan for Mateo and it doesn't take to much detective work to see how they hope to use Kjerstad. 

Actually, it does matter to me, because that's my own sentiment regarding the plan. 

But of course, Elias & Co doesn't give a phat what I think when formulating his plan.

[DirtyBird]

2 minutes ago, Jagwar said:

Actually, it does matter to me, because that's my own sentiment regarding the plan. 

But of course, Elias & Co doesn't give a phat what I think when formulating his plan.

RZNJ doesn’t know “the plan”

[RZNJ]

9 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Yes, you have tried to state what you think will happen as fact, and what management wants to happen. You have manipulated quotes to do this.

”we will give Jackson every opportunity to make the club” does not mean Jackson will make the club.

”we will get Mateo reps in CF” does not mean they have Mateo penciled in for the season plans at CF, especially since he hasn’t been used in games there.

And there is zero indication that Kjerstad is more likely to make the team than Cowser.

I have stated my opinion on what I think is “Plan A”.   I don’t believe I’ve manipulated any quotes or tried to present my opinion as some kind of indisputable fact.   I certainly agree that Holliday is not a guarantee but I think it’s likely based on what’s been done and said so far.  Mateo hasn’t played any outfield yet but I’ve stated my OPINION on why I think they want him to get more reps out there and how that might impact the roster construction.   

[Jagwar]

Just now, RZNJ said:

I have stated my opinion on what I think is “Plan A”.   I don’t believe I’ve manipulated any quotes or tried to present my opinion as some kind of indisputable fact.   I certainly agree that Holliday is not a guarantee but I think it’s likely based on what’s been done and said so far.  Mateo hasn’t played any outfield yet but I’ve stated my OPINION on why I think they want him to get more reps out there and how that might impact the roster construction.   

But... perhaps it "doesn't matter" what your opinion is... 

[RZNJ]

1 minute ago, DirtyBird said:

RZNJ doesn’t know “the plan”

I can only guess what I think the plan is.  Sorry it causes you so much angst.  LOL

[RZNJ]

5 minutes ago, Jagwar said:

But... perhaps it "doesn't matter" what your opinion is... 

Your opinion matters.  Unfortunately, your enthusiasm or lack of it isn’t going to have much effect on the roster construction.

And, of course, my opinion could be wrong.  My opinion certainly means nothing more than being my opinion.  I take what I read and see and try to figure out what Elias is thinking.  Pretty simple.

Edited February 28 by RZNJ

[Satyr3206]

I just want the plan to include a few WS Trophys.