Roch: O's may look to get a big bat this offseason

[Sports Guy]

So I guess that using any numbers from a less that 3 year sample is a fools errand when trying to evaluate any aspect of a players game? I think you take the SSS argument to a ridiculous extreme, when it suits your purposes. The defensive metrics, which are not as accurate as we would like them to be, but do have a value in appraising a players performance, suggest that Jones has been a poor OF this season. That may be due to a number of factors, injuries, weight gain, decline in skills, poor positioning. They don't indicate that he can't improve, but it would be silly to ignore them altogether because of SSS.

The stats tell you that for this year, he has been a disappointment in the field...That doesn't mean you need to do something drastic,..like your idiotic suggestion to move Nick to first.

It just means that this year, for whatever reason(and there is likely more than 1), the defense hasn't been as good.

[MisterCrash]

The suggestion that anyone other than Markakis is the best defensive outfielder on the team, at any position, is preposterous. Anyone who has watched the games and follows the numbers would pretty much be forced to agree. Markakis runs well, gets good reads on balls, can make athletic, acrobatic catches, and has arguably the best RF arm in baseball. Jones and Pie both make a lot of mental errors, Pie's arm isn't that great, and neither Scott nor Reimold run that well. Markakis is one of the best defensive OFs, at any of the three positions, in baseball; Pie, Reimold, and even Jones are still struggling for consistency and poise on a game-in, game-out basis. Suggesting that Markakis should move to 1B is...it's ridiculous.

[Fan4Life]

Suggesting that Markakis should move to 1B is...it's ridiculous.

If someone suggested that... you shouldn't have responded.

[El Gordo]

The stats tell you that for this year, he has been a disappointment in the field...That doesn't mean you need to do something drastic,..like your idiotic suggestion to move Nick to first.

It just means that this year, for whatever reason(and there is likely more than 1), the defense hasn't been as good.

I'm just suggesting that for defensive purposes, that would be our best OF, not based on this years stats but all the stats available form FB for the past four years, plus my own assesment watching them play. The difference between Scott in LF and Nick in RF is not as great, as the gain you would get fron Jones in RF and Pie in CF IMO. Only an idiot wouldn't understand that.:rolleyestf:

[Sports Guy]

I'm just suggesting that for defensive purposes, that would be our best OF, not based on this years stats but all the stats available form FB for the past four years, plus my own assesment watching them play. The difference between Scott in LF and Nick in RF is not as great, as the gain you would get fron Jones in RF and Pie in CF IMO. Only an idiot wouldn't understand that.:rolleyestf:

Not it wouldn't...Our best defensive OF is probably Pie in CF, Jones in LF and Nick in RF....Jones is better than Nick and LF is harder in OPACY than RF.

[El Gordo]

Not it wouldn't...Our best defensive OF is probably Pie in CF, Jones in LF and Nick in RF....Jones is better than Nick and LF is harder in OPACY than RF.

I disagree. Jones would be wasted in LF and we play 81 games in other parks.

[mweb]

LOL....Because of this year and his +/- stat?

That is crazy.

The guy has upper echelon defensive potential...He has showed it a lot and showed it last year...A few bad months doesn't change anything about his upside.

You are obsessed with the small sampling of these defensive stats.

I don't think it's crazy at all. His defense this year has been below average and his added weight makes it less likely that he'll be as good in CF as he could have been before he bulked up.

I'm not sure why El Gordo is getting hammered so much here. He said AJ is a good CF, not a great one. Despite all of the attacks on him, I haven't seen anyone disagree with that statement.

SG, you have often recently said that people jump on Trea for no good reason, well I think you and others are doing the same here. Yes, I think his Nick to first comments are absurd, and sure, he puts too much emphasis on 1 year of defensive stats, but his point about AJ which got attacked is not crazy at all.

[mweb]

As I've made clear, I don't want to trade a lot of top young talent for a big bat, however, if AM decides to go that route, I actually agree with El Gordo that Jones may be the guy to trade. I say that because I think Pie can give us good production in CF, and Jones' value may he higher than what it should be based off to that great start he had. I also don't think it would be wise to deal a lot of highly talented young pitching at this point.

But just to be clear, I'm not advocating trading him.

[El Gordo]

The stats tell you that for this year, he has been a disappointment in the field...That doesn't mean you need to do something drastic,..like your idiotic suggestion to move Nick to first.

It just means that this year, for whatever reason(and there is likely more than 1), the defense hasn't been as good.

2006 +3, 2007 -5. 2008 +11, 2009 -4, Which of those numbers doesn't fit? Is 4 years a SSS?

[mweb]

As I've made clear, I don't want to trade a lot of top young talent for a big bat, however, if AM decides to go that route, I actually agree with El Gordo that Jones may be the guy to trade. I say that because I think Pie can give us good production in CF, and Jones' value may he higher than what it should be based off to that great start he had. I also don't think it would be wise to deal a lot of highly talented young pitching at this point.

But just to be clear, I'm not advocating trading him.

And this continues to make more sense everyday imo.

And I'm shocked that no one has explained how el gordo's initial comment about Jones' defense was crazy or stupid.

[El Gordo]

And this continues to make more sense everyday imo.

And I'm shocked that no one has explained how el gordo's initial comment about Jones' defense was crazy or stupid.

It's just that they think that anything I say is crazy and stupid. When your a bloviator, it's hard to keep objective and doesn't really serve your purposes.

[DrungoHazewood]

Nick is by far our best outfielder. It isnt even close. Any other opinion to the contrary is laughable. AND THE IDEA OF MOVING HIM TO 1B IS TOTALLY ABSURD.

Yes, it would be absurd to move Markakis to first. But you're seriously telling me that Nick would be a better center fielder than Jones or Pie? Because I think that notion is totally absurd. Being a very good right or left fielder is not at all the same thing as being a good or excellent center fielder.

[connja]

Yes, it would be absurd to move Markakis to first. But you're seriously telling me that Nick would be a better center fielder than Jones or Pie? Because I think that notion is totally absurd. Being a very good right or left fielder is not at all the same thing as being a good or excellent center fielder.

Nick would be our best defensive player at any of the 3 outfield positions. Unfortunately there is only one of him.

[LookinUp]

The suggestion that anyone other than Markakis is the best defensive outfielder on the team, at any position, is preposterous. Anyone who has watched the games and follows the numbers would pretty much be forced to agree. Markakis runs well, gets good reads on balls, can make athletic, acrobatic catches, and has arguably the best RF arm in baseball. Jones and Pie both make a lot of mental errors, Pie's arm isn't that great, and neither Scott nor Reimold run that well. Markakis is one of the best defensive OFs, at any of the three positions, in baseball; Pie, Reimold, and even Jones are still struggling for consistency and poise on a game-in, game-out basis. Suggesting that Markakis should move to 1B is...it's ridiculous.

Nick is by far our best outfielder. It isnt even close. Any other opinion to the contrary is laughable. AND THE IDEA OF MOVING HIM TO 1B IS TOTALLY ABSURD.

Nick would be our best defensive player at any of the 3 outfield positions. Unfortunately there is only one of him.

I can't tell if these three posts are serious or if they fit into the category of "Chuck Norris can slam revolving doors." :scratchchinhmm:

[DrungoHazewood]

Nick would be our best defensive player at any of the 3 outfield positions. Unfortunately there is only one of him.

I'm pretty sure the Orioles strenuously disagree with this assessment. Nick last played center in 2006, and was permanently moved to right sometime during the season. His "competition" in center included Corey Patterson, who was good, but also David Newhan, Luis Terrero, Luis Matos, and Jeff Fiorentino. In 2007, when he could still have plausibly been moved back over, the team instead chose to play Jay Payton, Patterson, Tike Redman, Freddy Bynum, and Adam Stern there.

If Nick was a better defensive outfielder than Adam Jones or Felix Pie there's no way the O's would play Jeff Fiorentino, Tike Redman and Freddy Bynum there instead.