So how about Brian Roberts today?

[El Gordo]

He was only slightly better than a league-average hitter at 32. If he puts up a 105 OPS+ and -10 defense at second he's not going to be a very good player.

He doesn't have to be a very good player, he just has to be better than last year's 2B and better than this year's in house options.

[El Gordo]

I must be easily shocked. I would be shocked by a .800+ OPS from Roberts.

P.S. Probably premature to bring up the offseason Roberts thread but might be fun just the same.

Didn't we do a poll. I'd like to see those results if we did......:scratchchinhmm::laughlol:

[SrMeowMeow]

He doesn't have to be a very good player, he just has to be better than last year's 2B and better than this year's in house options.

Why would we use war-crimes-atrocity-bad production as our baseline? All it does is make basically any player look good, and tell us nothing. It's not like our wins in 2013 are going to be 2012 wins +/- change in 2B production.

[DrungoHazewood]

He doesn't have to be a very good player, he just has to be better than last year's 2B and better than this year's in house options.

If your baseline is last year's performance. I don't think it's much of a compliment (or he's much of an asset) if he's somewhat better than some other terrible options. The Orioles need to get significantly better performances than last year if they want to approach last year's win total.

Edit: Or... what SrMeowMeow just said.

[DrungoHazewood]

Didn't we do a poll. I'd like to see those results if we did......:scratchchinhmm::laughlol:

If I recall correctly the poll wasn't "what do you think Brian Roberts will OPS in spring training?" Spring numbers are bought with Syd Thrift's Confederate Money.

[SrMeowMeow]

If your baseline is last year's performance. I don't think it's much of a compliment (or he's much of an asset) if he's somewhat better than some other terrible options. The Orioles need to get significantly better performances than last year if they want to approach last year's win total.

Edit: Or... what SrMeowMeow just said.

Kind of freaky.

[El Gordo]

If your baseline is last year's performance. I don't think it's much of a compliment (or he's much of an asset) if he's somewhat better than some other terrible options. The Orioles need to get significantly better performances than last year if they want to approach last year's win total.

Edit: Or... what SrMeowMeow just said.

Did I say that?I thought I said he had two hurdles to over come 1) he has to be better than last year's 2B and 2) better than this year's in house options. I think if he stays healthy he will be an ugrade over Casilla in spite of his defense,but I am not so sure he will be better than either Navarro or Flaherty. I am pretty sure he will not be so much worse than those two,that it would justify eating 10M.

[El Gordo]

If I recall correctly the poll wasn't "what do you think Brian Roberts will OPS in spring training?" Spring numbers are bought with Syd Thrift's Confederate Money.

I don't know if there was a poll at all but if there was I would think it would have been something along the lines of "should Roberts retire for the good of the team and forfeit the 10M."

[SrMeowMeow]

Did I say that?I thought I said he had two hurdles to over come 1) he has to be better than last year's 2B and 2) better than this year's in house options. I think if he stays healthy he will be an ugrade over Casilla in spite of his defense,but I am not so sure he will be better than either Navarro or Flaherty. I am pretty sure he will not be so much worse than those two,that it would justify eating 10M.

He gets 10M no matter what we do with him. It's irrelevant.

[Frobby]

I must be easily shocked. I would be shocked by a .800+ OPS from Roberts.

P.S. Probably premature to bring up the 25 offseason Roberts threads but might be fun just the same.

Fixed that for you...seems like this subject was brought up over and over this winter.

[DrungoHazewood]

Did I say that?I thought I said he had two hurdles to over come 1) he has to be better than last year's 2B and 2) better than this year's in house options. I think if he stays healthy he will be an ugrade over Casilla in spite of his defense,but I am not so sure he will be better than either Navarro or Flaherty. I am pretty sure he will not be so much worse than those two,that it would justify eating 10M.

Ok, just making sure you aren't defining "good" as "better than last year's sinkhole, but still below average."

[El Gordo]

Ok, just making sure you aren't defining "good" as "better than last year's sinkhole, but still below average."

I didn't say he had to be very "good" either Herr Hyperbole.

[DrungoHazewood]

He doesn't have to be a very good player, he just has to be better than last year's 2B and better than this year's in house options.

I didn't say he had to be very "good" either Herr Hyperbole.

Ach mensch. So you didn't, es tut mir leid. Given that, I'm not quite sure what the point is. If he's just a bit better than last year's second basemen and this year's in-house options, what does that give us? A moderate upgrade over some terrible players. That's certainly not pushing the Orioles to the playoffs.

Auf wiedersehen.

[Flosman]

Ach mensch. So you didn't, es tut mir leid. Given that, I'm not quite sure what the point is. If he's just a bit better than last year's second basemen and this year's in-house options, what does that give us? A moderate upgrade over some terrible players. That's certainly not pushing the Orioles to the playoffs.

Auf wiedersehen.

I think this is flawed logic trying to make many predictions around here look better. Simply put the O's are better if he puts up better numbers than the black hole of 2b put up last season. The O's are a defending playoff team and if they are better at a position this year that is a positive thing and should lead to more wins. It can be argued that they could do even better but could they really? Internally maybe Flaherty could be better and at some point this season Schoop might be a better option, but he looks like the Brob of old and that is a pretty high level of play that unproven rookies don't get the opportunity to beat until it is proven the gas tank is empty or at least shown that is likely the case, IMO. Are there external options that actually look better? not that I see.

The argument that you don't use last year as a barometer is flawed. Constant improvement is the way to be great and being better than last year is how that is done.

[SrMeowMeow]

The argument that you don't use last year as a barometer is flawed. Constant improvement is the way to be great and being better than last year is how that is done.

Of course it will be a good thing to improve on last year's 2B production. The point is that basically any 2B on a 25-man roster right now could probably be an improvement over last year, so it's not a statement that conveys any kind of meaning.