Roberts to the Cubs again?

[davearm]

Well, he does have a point...If EPat is that good and the Cubs need and want a second baseman, why trade 3 players for one when you can just start your own guy right now?

Plenty of contenders start rookies and succeed.

Patterson is the third piece in this deal, and has a decent chance of being as good or better than Roberts. Get his defense straightened out, and you've got exactly the kind of buy-low homerun the O's need to be swinging for.

Meanwhile the Cubs get a proven player that's much more of a sure thing for this year and next.

O's get guys that any/all could be solid contributors for many more than two years, and for assuming the risk that they may not pan out, they get three such players.

In this case a bird in the hand is worth three in the bush.

But you know all this already.

[Sports Guy]

And SG said that it was basically an even trade, give or take a little. That's what I'm disagreeing with.

SG didn't say that...I was answering the question using the players out there.

[davearm]

That is not the point. The point is that you guys are so quick to dump him, yet you are saying how great he is. Can EPat even play 2B? If he can't do you really think we will move Adam Jones to make room for EPat?

Nobody's saying Patterson is great. Certainly not me. Great potential though, which is precisely what the O's ought to be scouring the market looking for.

I dunno if he can play 2B, but Baltimore is in the ideal situation to try and find out. The Cubs, not so much.

I'll tell you the same thing I just told SG:

Patterson is the third piece in this deal, and has a decent chance of being as good or better than Roberts. Get his defense straightened out, and you've got exactly the kind of buy-low homerun the O's need to be swinging for.

[Sports Guy]

Forget the Cubs anyway...If you can get Peralta and another piece for BRob, you have to do that. I even prefer Peralta to Pie.

[davearm]

Can't a great majority of teams offer better players than the production of Hernandez and Bynum? That tandem might well be among the worst-offensively producing duo in the major leagues in the past 10 years. It's not a real high bar, there, for the Cubs or anyone else to clear to improve our middle-infield offense. (Of course, I wonder how many playoff teams last year had middle infielder EqAs both under .262? It's not like the proposed Cubs offer provides a realistic base from which to generate a playoff contender in three or four years.)

I'd rather look to improve the middle infield next year than acquire back-ups like Murton, Cedeno and EPat for BRob - none of whom will likely every reach the all-star production of Brian Roberts. Roberts has more current production (like VORP) than all three proposed Cubs - so why should we make this trade?

Hey I've said all along, that if another team is offering something better, then by all means, the O's should take it.

But make no mistake, any combination of these Cubs guys offer more value for the O's future than does two more losing years with Roberts. The only real value in that is the potential for a couple of draft picks.

[davearm]

I was wondering what the take back would be for defense in the above scenario???

The difference between Cedeno and Hernandez is almost certainly being vastly overstated on here.

Both guys came up through the minors with stellar defense as their calling card.

[Sports Guy]

I bet you could get EPat for someone like Hoey.

[skiba7]

Forget the Cubs anyway...If you can get Peralta and another piece for BRob, you have to do that. I even prefer Peralta to Pie.

Has anybody even reported that Peralta is being offered?

[Rob H]

Honestly, and I've been thinking of this for a while now... I think this whole trade is being done wrong.

Roberts for Colvin, Burke, Huseby, and Hernandez.

The O's would some prospects that are pretty far out, but have some very high ceilings... as opposed to guys with above average ceilings, but not the sort of talent that can turn a franchise around in a hurry. No sure thing in the deal, but if they all pan out, that would be ridiculously lopsided in the O's favor. Hell, if even one of them pans out and hits their ceiling for six years under club control, the O's would win.

[Sports Guy]

Honestly, and I've been thinking of this for a while now... I think this whole trade is being done wrong.

Roberts for Colvin, Burke, Huseby, and Hernandez.

The O's would some prospects that are pretty far out, but have some very high ceilings... as opposed to guys with above average ceilings, but not the sort of talent that can turn a franchise around in a hurry. No sure thing in the deal, but if they all pan out, that would be ridiculously lopsided in the O's favor. Hell, if even one of them pans out and hits their ceiling for six years under club control, the O's would win.

The Orioles need some ML ready talent.

[Mad Mark]

Patterson is the third piece in this deal, and has a decent chance of being as good or better than Roberts. Get his defense straightened out, and you've got exactly the kind of buy-low homerun the O's need to be swinging for.

Meanwhile the Cubs get a proven player that's much more of a sure thing for this year and next.

O's get guys that any/all could be solid contributors for many more than two years, and for assuming the risk that they may not pan out, they get three such players.

In this case a bird in the hand is worth three in the bush.

But you know all this already.

What about the issue with Patterson's lateness? Big thing? Little thing? Nothing? My only concern is making sure the Orioles are not adding head cases to the roster...just subtracting them.

[Rob H]

The Orioles need some ML ready talent.

You're gonna have a very hard time finding anybody willing to trade away ML ready players with high ceilings for Roberts. You probably get ML ready or high ceiling, but not both.

[davearm]

Forget the Cubs anyway...If you can get Peralta and another piece for BRob, you have to do that. I even prefer Peralta to Pie.

Ugh. Peralta's got a faintly Jorge Cantu smell about him -- a big age 23 season made people think he's something he's not -- at least temporarily.

Peralta's power and onbase skills have disappeared just as quickly as they arrived.

[davearm]

You're gonna have a very hard time finding anybody willing to trade away ML ready players with high ceilings for Roberts. You probably get ML ready or high ceiling, but not both.

Well said.

Look the O's have to decide if they want one guy like Miller, a few guys like Cedeno, Patterson, Murton, or a bunch of guys like the ones Rob mentioned earlier. A Pie++ caliber deal isn't happening.

[davearm]

What about the issue with Patterson's lateness? Big thing? Little thing? Nothing? My only concern is making sure the Orioles are not adding head cases to the roster...just subtracting them.

It's certainly not nothing. You don't get sent home for nothing.

That leaves little or big. Or maybe halfway in between, which would be my guess.