Roberts to the Cubs again?

[davearm]

Then why would the Cubs deal all that updide talent for Roberts. Roberts is so far ahead of Patterson it's not funny.

You want guys that are cheaper, younger AND BETTER TOO?

Compare the two guys at the same age and see what the conclusion looks like. (Hint: Roberts looks like a poor-man's Patterson.)

[thundercleetz]

The answer is yes, although that's not the relevant comparison.

What I said was that the three Cubbies are better than anything else the O's have, absent Roberts, who most agree should be dealt in the rebuild as opposed to taking draft picks for in two years.

Again I'll cite PECOTA.

Murton .276 EqA > Huff .269 EqA

Cedeno .251 EqA > Hernandez .209 EqA

Patterson .261 EqA > Bynum .241 EqA

As you can see, it's not even particularly close.

Of course it isn't close, look what we have. That doesn't mean we should trade Roberts. I agree with Bigbird, if these guys were so great they would be starting for the Cubs.

[bigbird]

The answer is yes, although that's not the relevant comparison.

What I said was that the three Cubbies are better than anything else the O's have, absent Roberts, who most agree should be dealt in the rebuild as opposed to taking draft picks for in two years.

Again I'll cite PECOTA.

Murton .276 EqA > Huff .269 EqA

Cedeno .251 EqA > Hernandez .209 EqA

Patterson .261 EqA > Bynum .241 EqA

As you can see, it's not even particularly close.

First, I don't put a whold lot of stock ino PECOTA. If it were that accurate a tool every major league team would use it to a T. Second I 'd actually rather have the 2 top 40 draft picks after 2009 because those three guys won't be on the roster then. Using your figures above that is still note enough of an upgrade if any to deal one of baseballs best leadoff men.

[rolliefingers]

Maybe we sweeten the offer a little. What about Roberts and Olson for Peralta and Miller?

If we trade with the Indians, I think you have to add in whatever you need to add in order to get quality. Adam Miller is a very good pitcher. If we have to add something, fine. I'm sure they'd be interested in some bullpen arms.

[Sports Guy]

How? Cedeno is an upgrade offensively over Hernandez but a sizeable downgrade defensively. Patterson is a very sizeable downgrade offensively and a huge downgrade defensively (in fact not considered good enough to stick at the position by many). Murton might provide as much offense as Huff from the DH spot (especially in the first half of the season) but doesn't give you the versatility of being able to plug him in at 3B or 1B. And three years down the road, if Roberts and Huff are never traded and don't re-sign, you get two draft picks for Roberts and probably one for Huff is he stays ranked with 3B/2B/SS, whereas Cedeno, Patterson and Murton you'd have to replace to field a truly competitive team and wouldn't net you any draft picks or much in trades.

I think this may be the only true statement in this post.

[bigbird]

You want guys that are cheaper, younger AND BETTER TOO?

Compare the two guys at the same age and see what the conclusion looks like. (Hint: Roberts looks like a poor-man's Patterson.)

Then the Cubs should just keep him and start him at 2B.

[skiba7]

How? Cedeno is an upgrade offensively over Hernandez but a sizeable downgrade defensively. Patterson is a very sizeable downgrade offensively and a huge downgrade defensively (in fact not considered good enough to stick at the position by many). Murton might provide as much offense as Huff from the DH spot (especially in the first half of the season) but doesn't give you the versatility of being able to plug him in at 3B or 1B. And three years down the road, if Roberts and Huff are never traded and don't re-sign, you get two draft picks for Roberts and probably one for Huff is he stays ranked with 3B/2B/SS, whereas Cedeno, Patterson and Murton you'd have to replace to field a truly competitive team and wouldn't net you any draft picks or much in trades.

I was under the impressiong he was talking purely about offense. Anyways, I don't think Cedeno is nearly as bad defensively as you think.

[Sports Guy]

If Gallagher, Murton and EPat/Cedeno was the best deal on the table, i would make the trade. I wouldn't go to ST with BRob on the team if we got those 3 guys back.

That being said, its not a GREAT trade for us...It is a fair deal but nothing that makes you jump up and down either.

No way I deal him for Murton, EPat and Cedeno though.

[allstar1579]

I was under the impressiong he was talking purely about offense. Anyways, I don't think Cedeno is nearly as bad defensively as you think.

He's not awful defensively, but Hernandez is amazing with the glove. He just can't hit a lick. Many teams have won with a great defensive/bad offensive SS, it is just the trend in the past decade that SS needs to be an offensive position to win. If you have a team that keeps the ball on the ground (which you have to do to win in OPACY), then the runs saved by having more range and better hands at SS could easily balance the offense lost. What would the Diamondbacks or Rockies look like when Webb or Francis pitches if they had 2 awful defensive INF.

[davearm]

Then the Cubs should just keep him and start him at 2B.

This comment makes me think you really don't grasp why contending teams and rebuilding teams make trades like this.

[JoeOrsulak]

I wouldn't be that excited about Fields for BRob straight up anyway.

The Sox don't have much to offer...The idea of Konerko to the Angels to get players to deal for BRob may work??

Give me your best 3 way deal assuming these are the key players:

Angels: Konerko, _____, ______

CHW: Roberts, Kotchman, ______

O's: Wood, _____, ______

[Sports Guy]

This comment makes me think you really don't grasp why contending teams and rebuilding teams make trades like this.

Well, he does have a point...If EPat is that good and the Cubs need and want a second baseman, why trade 3 players for one when you can just start your own guy right now?

Plenty of contenders start rookies and succeed.

[allstar1579]

If Gallagher, Murton and EPat/Cedeno was the best deal on the table, i would make the trade. I wouldn't go to ST with BRob on the team if we got those 3 guys back.

That being said, its not a GREAT trade for us...It is a fair deal but nothing that makes you jump up and down either.

No way I deal him for Murton, EPat and Cedeno though.

If Patterson was going to be so great, every Cub fan wouldn't be trying to dump him in this trade. Same goes for Cedeno, although I have heard a few scouts that haven't given up on him completely.

I still think there are other teams that can offer 2 players better than the 3 the Cubs can offer though. Let's see if any other offers come through, we know what the Cubs will pay.

[Sports Guy]

Give me your best 3 way deal assuming these are the key players:

Angels: Konerko, _____, ______

CHW: Roberts, Kotchman, ______

O's: Wood, _____, ______

The Orioles may be able to get another player but that would be basically it.

[thundercleetz]

This comment makes me think you really don't grasp why contending teams and rebuilding teams make trades like this.

That is not the point. The point is that you guys are so quick to dump him, yet you are saying how great he is. Can EPat even play 2B? If he can't do you really think we will move Adam Jones to make room for EPat?