2016 Team

[fastball]

It's time to think about 2016. This team is not a championship team.

To many if's, which is how the O's started the season. Sorry, I've been a fan for 30yrs.seen some

good teams and seem some not so good.

[Bahama O's Fan]

I'm not ready to give up on this team yet, but it is fun to talk about next year. Here's where I see the team, right now, with no signs or trades:

C-Joseph

1B-?

2B-Schoop

SS-Hardy

3B-Machado

LF-Lough

CF-Jones

RF-Snider

DH-Paredes

SP-Ubaldo

SP-Tillman

SP-Gonzalez

SP-Gausman

SP-Bundy/Wright

CL-Britton

RP-Brach

RP-MacFarlane

RP-Bundy/Wright

RP-Some arms from Norfolk

[Bahama O's Fan]

I'm not ready to give up on this team yet' date=' but it is fun to talk about next year. Here's where I see the team, right now, with no signs or trades:

C-Joseph

1B-?

2B-Schoop

SS-Hardy

3B-Machado

LF-Lough

CF-Jones

RF-Snider

DH-Paredes

SP-Ubaldo

SP-Tillman

SP-Gonzalez

SP-Gausman

SP-Bundy/Wright

CL-Britton

RP-Brach

RP-MacFarlane

RP-Bundy/Wright

RP-Some arms from Norfolk[/quote']

Sorry, Bench: Flaherty, Clevenger, Reimold, Alvarez (one of them might start)

[osfanfrom70]

I'm not ready to give up on this team yet' date=' but it is fun to talk about next year. Here's where I see the team, right now, with no signs or trades:

C-Joseph

1B-?

2B-Schoop

SS-Hardy

3B-Machado

LF-Lough

CF-Jones

RF-Snider

DH-Paredes

SP-Ubaldo

SP-Tillman

SP-Gonzalez

SP-Gausman

SP-Bundy/Wright

CL-Britton

RP-Brach

RP-MacFarlane

RP-Bundy/Wright

RP-Some arms from Norfolk[/quote']

If we go into next season with Lough, Paderes, and Snider in the starting lineup DD should be fired no questions asked. That would be terrible.

[Going Underground]

I'm not ready to give up on this team yet' date=' but it is fun to talk about next year. Here's where I see the team, right now, with no signs or trades:

C-Joseph

1B-?

2B-Schoop

SS-Hardy

3B-Machado

LF-Lough

CF-Jones

RF-Snider

DH-Paredes

SP-Ubaldo

SP-Tillman

SP-Gonzalez

SP-Gausman

SP-Bundy/Wright

CL-Britton

RP-Brach

RP-MacFarlane

RP-Bundy/Wright

RP-Some arms from Norfolk[/quote']

That lineup is not too impressive. I think Young will be back. Macfarlane might be a good pickup. Can Stewie or Chris play first base?Peter could be a Prince Fielder type first baseman. So no Wilson or Garcia?

[Bahama O's Fan]

Sorry, not meaning to list any acquisitions, just who is going to be around after FA. And yeah, maybe Wilson and Garcia for the pen.

[Aristotelian]

Sorry' date=' not meaning to list any acquisitions, just who is going to be around after FA. And yeah, maybe Wilson and Garcia for the pen.[/quote']

By this criteria, 1B is Parmelee.

I have a hard time seeing Bundy in the rotation. I think he is more likely to get the Gausman treatment to reduce his innings load and at least start the year as longman/spot starter. I think Wilson has a higher chance of starting.

We will need a matchup LHP in the bullpen. Looks like that guy would be Cabral. Drake already has some MLB experience so he is probably on the list of organizational guys that would be on the roster assuming no acquisitions.

Paredes might be our DH today, but he is quickly reverting to Normal Jimmy. I just dropped him from my fantasy team, and I believe the Orioles will follow suit shortly if this continues. In which case, add Christian Walker as a bench bat/platoon DH.

[Bahama O's Fan]

So now that we have identified who will be left, what areas do we need to upgrade and who do you spend the money on? How much, and please be realistic.

[Three Run Homer]

It sure would be nice to have some legitimate hitting prospects in the high minors. If we wind up selling at the deadline, that should be what we target in return.

There are very few potential impact players at corner positions who might make it to free agency: Alex Gordon, Justin Upton, Jason Heyward (looking less like an impact bat every season). Toronto has options on Batista and Encarnacion.

Even if ownership is willing to spend top dollar to get someone like Gordon or Upton, are we willing to give up our first round pick again, given how weak our farm system is?

[eddie83]

Didn't we know this wasn't a championship team before the season? Yeah, right now it's worse than most thought it would be but this team was never a championship team on paper. It was supposed to be a team that could "compete" for a playoff spot. We'll see but it doesn't look good right now. 2016 will be tough to predict, especially if the O's trade off some pieces this year and get some 2016 pieces back. Right now.

Rotation

Tillman

Jimenez

Gonzalez

Gausman

Bundy/Wright/Wilson/McFarland

Bullpen

Britton

Brach

Choose 5 (Cesar Cabral, McFarland, Bundy, Jorge Rondon, M. Wright, Drake, Givens, Rowen, Roe)

1B - ??

2B - Schoop

SS - Hardy

3B - Machado

C - Joseph

LF - Snider

CF - Jones

RF - ??

DH - ???

Extras Flaherty/Paredes/Lough

In general I agree with your roster. That is a dirt cheap pitching staff.

The thing that worries me is that if we don't start adding more offense it is going to be harder to make the playoffs without a true staff ace. We will have less margin for error. Our depth of our lineup has been a strength the last 3 seasons. Not that complicated if we start scoring less we need to let up fewer runs.

[Orioles0615]

So now that we have identified who will be left' date=' what areas do we need to upgrade and who do you spend the money on? How much, and please be realistic.[/quote']

Well the 3 big names are Cespedes, Upton, and Heyward. They will be too much unfortunately so cross them off Then you have guys like Adam Lind, Denard Span, David Murphy, Colby Rasmus. They will be too much as well so cross them off.

So we will most likely be looking at players from the minor league free agent list and rule 5 picks.

[SteveO]

It sure would be nice to have some legitimate hitting prospects in the high minors. If we wind up selling at the deadline, that should be what we target in return.

There are very few potential impact players at corner positions who might make it to free agency: Alex Gordon, Justin Upton, Jason Heyward (looking less like an impact bat every season). Toronto has options on Batista and Encarnacion.

Even if ownership is willing to spend top dollar to get someone like Gordon or Upton, are we willing to give up our first round pick again, given how weak our farm system is?

The real problem the Orioles have is a lack of identity/philosophy. They want to approach things like a moneyball team in terms of cost but are unwilling to make the painful moves that are required to really be successful using that method. There is a reason Oakland moved the guys they did rather than let them walk. It was about setting up the minors with the positional talent to make their next run with the young arms they have. It may or may not work but it has more basis in reality than what we are doing IMO

For me the approach of this offseason was huge mistake going into an offseason like the one we are staring down. You either bring back a team that is better and can take that next step and compete for a championship or you start moving some of guys you can to start restocking some talent for your rather bare system. We seem to go half in both ways. Yea we spend money to bring back guys but we don't spend the premium it will take to get tot he next level (or even stay on par IMO).

We can talk about how FA money is overpaying all we want and it very very true. If you want to avoid that then you have to develop your own talent. Thinking that signing the likes of Pearce, Parmelee, Reimold and other bandaid players can consistently provide a path to winning naive and wishful thinking. We did not become a threat in the AL East because of those type of guys we became a threat because of some wise trades (Tillman, Jones, etc) and some young guys who developed into reasonably good players. Right now looking at the level of positional talent in the system, the concern should be more about bringing in some decent talent than if we can somehow be the best of the turds in the AL East and get waxed in the playoffs.

[SteveO]

Sorry, pal. We became a contender because of a bunch of cheap moves and minor trades. Gonzalez and Chen solidified the rotation. Chris Davis came in a fairly minor trade (Koji wasn't Koji back then). Our offense last year was fueled by a FA who fell into our laps and a castoff journeyman (Steve Pearce). We were a team built on a good bullpen, decent starting pitching, and home runs.

Last year we led he majors in home runs with 211. Next was Colorado (186) (should they really be counted?), and Toronto (177).

This year we are 9th in the majors with 57 in 52 games. Houston and the Dodges lead with 74. In a nustshel, we are not hitting enough home runs.

Our RF's are 23rd in the majors with 4 home runs (we still don't miss Markakis)

Our CF's are tied with 4 other teams for 6th with 6 home runs.

Our LF's are tied with 4 other teams for 21st with 4 home runs.

Our outfield has 14 home runs at the 1/3 mark of the season. That's not who we were. Obviously, that's a pace of 42 for the year from our entire outfield.

In 2014 we got 30 homers from LF, 29 from CF, and 19 from RF for a total of 78.

Houston hasn't outplayed us. They'e out homered us.

Every team in baseball has those guys they have picked up off the scrap heap or gotten cheap and have gotten much more mileage than expected. Think the Cubs thought they would get the production out of Arrieta they have? DD may be better than most at finding those guys but thinking that he can fill an entire team that is competitive in that regard is incorrect in my opinion. There has to be a solid base of talent for those type of guys to supplement.

I agree that budget moves like Pearce, Chen and Gonzalez have paid off in spades. Cruz was an animal of another nature IMO and situation that is unlikely to happen all that often or we would be talking about this years Cruz on the team.

I still stand by the gist of what I am saying. At the end of the day the Orioles neither want to spend the big money in FA or move the talent they have who could walk as FA's if they adhere to not spending big money on FA's. All I am saying here is that IMO the Orioles should have either swallowed the buck and spent the money on a guy like Cruz and perhaps someone else OR should have (or still) moved guys who have value for the best possible prospects they can to build some talent to supplement the young arms we have. If I am wrong I am wrong just how I see it. The goal should not be to put together a team that can be the best of the AL East turds, it should be to put together a team that can be the best in the AL period. With the right additions I think we could have. Taking the other approach with the right trades of guys we currently have I think we can be in the next few years. Sitting on the fence though is a sure way to find yourself sitting on the fence again later from my standpoint.

"Houston has not outplayed us. They have out homered us" So now hitting more home runs while winning more games than another team is not outplaying that team? WTH is that? Sorry man but Houston has outplayed us. Its as simple as that. Look at the standings.

[SteveO]

I think we agree mostly. My remark about Houston is partly because the home run has been our MO for the last 3 years. We led the league last year. We hit 211 last year. We're on a pace for about 175 right now. I think we are 6th or 9th in the majors. Houston beat us at our own game. They didn't necesarily run the bases better or play better defense or make better decisions. They have hit 6 home runs. We have none and 3 losses.

That is fair.

[sportsfan8703]

The pitching staff could actually be better next year, even with losing Chen, Norris, O'day. It's the lineup that scares me. Right now we have Jones, Machado, Hardy, Schoop/Flaherty, Joseph/Clevenger, and 4 open spots. It looks alot like this year just minus Davis. Snider, Parades, Parmelee, Alvarez, Walker, Reimold, Urrutia. Just a different cast. But the pitching looks good.

Tillman, Ubaldo, Gonzo, Gausman, Wright

Britton, Brach, Bundy, Givens, Wilson