Orioles to take another shot at extending Machado per Roch

[Redskins Rick]

4 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Except Belle.... 

 

and Belle was a cream puff as he could've DH'd through his guaranteed contract.

Did he ever admit to knowing he had the condition?

[big_sparxx]

you either compete, or you don't. You either believe that Manny is an MVP caliber player and you move whatever mountain you can to re-sign him. Not every trade will be an Erik Bedard deal, not many teams will get raped like that again, and now Manny's trade value is at an all time low... and getting lower. No one will give us anything near his worth with one year left on his contract.

Manny puts butts in seats. He's not the only one obviously, but I don't think there's any other player in MLB who can do what he can, and when he's at his best, he is the best. Plain and simple. With him we are a better team. Regardless of how bad we were last year, and anyone who tries to imply that our season sucked because of him is nuts. 

This isn't even up for debate. Lose him and you are losing a once in a generation type of player. Not since Brooks have we had anyone close at that position, and when you have to replace him with the likes of a Flaherty or reasonable facsimile, you are looking at YEARS mediocrity. 

Manny gives us a chance. Signing him sends a message to other players that B'more is an ok place to play and that we want to compete. Not so much if he's gone. I understand the variables in play, I understand that Angelos has to make it happen and that he's not proven to be anything close to reliable. If he's a business man, he's gonna do the right thing. A half-empty Camden Yards, or a stadium invaded by Sawx fans or MFY fans isn't a place I want to go. Bigger picture, CD was a bad investment, but there was every idea that he was going to be considering how many offers he had. 

You think Manny will be on the market long? If he stays healthy, he's a star, and there's no price you can put on that.

Be careful what you ask for.  

[webbrick2010]

Look I think most here and all experts believe the O's can't compete in 2018, just not enough pitching available to fill the holes in the O's rotation

So trade Manny for starting pitching prospects, and sign him as a FA for 2019.

Why can't that be the solution?

[Redskins Rick]

2 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

Look I think most here and all experts believe the O's can't compete in 2018, just not enough pitching available to fill the holes in the O's rotation

So trade Manny for starting pitching prospects, and sign him as a FA for 2019.

Why can't that be the solution?

Twice the "experts" picked the Orioles to finish last under Buck, and twice he took teams to the playoffs.

So trade him like Seattle traded Jones and Tilly for Bedard, a solid left handed TOR, how did that work out for Seattle?

[Luke-OH]

16 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Twice the "experts" picked the Orioles to finish last under Buck, and twice he took teams to the playoffs.

So trade him like Seattle traded Jones and Tilly for Bedard, a solid left handed TOR, how did that work out for Seattle?

No trade him like the Orioles traded Bedard for Jones and TIlly, your logic here is backwards.

[Roll Tide]

15 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

Look I think most here and all experts believe the O's can't compete in 2018, just not enough pitching available to fill the holes in the O's rotation

So trade Manny for starting pitching prospects, and sign him as a FA for 2019.

Why can't that be the solution?

Because DD and Buch are not under contract after 2018. So they don't care about beyond that. DD is managing for his next job and Showalter a move to the front office or perhaps retirement

 

Hopefully Brady is whispering to Angelos, and Duquette is being directed if he can't be resigned

[24fps]

7 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Twice the "experts" picked the Orioles to finish last under Buck, and twice he took teams to the playoffs.

So trade him like Seattle traded Jones and Tilly for Bedard, a solid left handed TOR, how did that work out for Seattle?

No one who's advocating trading Manny this off season is suggesting the O's follow Seattle's thought process.

[Redskins Rick]

Just now, 24fps said:

No one who's advocating trading Manny this off season is suggesting the O's follow Seattle's thought process.

Bedard had one of the finest Left hand arms in the business and this is Jim Palmer's assessment.

He came off a 5.7 WAR season and a 3.9 the year before and both were terrible teams.

Nobody knew that he would get hurt and turn out to be one of the worse trades ever.

 

 

 

[24fps]

8 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Bedard had one of the finest Left hand arms in the business and this is Jim Palmer's assessment.

He came off a 5.7 WAR season and a 3.9 the year before and both were terrible teams.

Nobody knew that he would get hurt and turn out to be one of the worse trades ever.

 

 

 

But what's your point?  That the O's shouldn't trade Manny because Seattle once made a trade that didn't work out?  

If you can't find a killer trade for Manny, then keep him.  There are worse things in life than having Manny Machado on your team, but don't shut the door on the idea when the O's 2018 rotation looks like it currently does.

[Babypowder]

1 minute ago, 24fps said:

But what's your point?  That the O's shouldn't trade Manny because Seattle once made a trade that didn't work out?  

If you can't find a killer trade for Manny, then keep him.  There are worse things in life than having Manny Machado on your team, but don't shut the door on the idea when the O's 2018 rotation looks like it currently does.

Obviously, the far better option than trading him is to keep him all year, miss the playoffs, and have him walk away for middling draft picks.

Otherwise, you might make a bad trade.

[Redskins Rick]

Just now, 24fps said:

But what's your point?  That the O's shouldn't trade Manny because Seattle once made a trade that didn't work out?  

If you can't find a killer trade for Manny, then keep him.  There are worse things in life than having Manny Machado on your team, but don't shut the door on the idea when the O's 2018 rotation looks like it currently does.

Who knows what my point?

Sorry, I just hate to see Manny traded, Ive seen many a trade over the decades, and usually the Orioles get burned, more then they get helped.

 

[Aristotelian]

5 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Who knows what my point?

Sorry, I just hate to see Manny traded, Ive seen many a trade over the decades, and usually the Orioles get burned, more then they get helped.

 

I think all of us would like to see Manny signed. But if he is not signed, we should at least try to get something back. The whole "last hurrah" with a mediocre team seems destined to fail in the short term without accelerating the rebuild, the worst of both worlds.

[OriolesMagic83]

Seattle traded Griffey and Randy Johnson and let ARod leave as a free agent and then won 116 games.  Building a team around the top players in the game isn't the only way to win. 

[Luke-OH]

40 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Who knows what my point?

Sorry, I just hate to see Manny traded, Ive seen many a trade over the decades, and usually the Orioles get burned, more then they get helped.

 

The Orioles have made some of the most lopsided positive trades in recent history.  A couple fringe relief prospects for JJ Hardy.  Chris Davis and Tommy Hunter for Koji.  Tilly and Jones for Bedard.

[Roll Tide]

3 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

Seattle traded Griffey and Randy Johnson and let ARod leave as a free agent and then won 116 games.  Building a team around the top players in the game isn't the only way to win. 

The  rules are different now...If Machado leaves via Free Agency we get a lot less than before.