Things to try for the starting rotation

[wildcard]

Means, Cashner and Bundy belong in the starting rotation.    Hyde has as much as said that Hess and Straily are only in the rotation because they don't have anyone  better.   Here is what I think should be happening.

1) Of course, Cobb will be in the rotation as soon as he is healthy and pitching well.   Who knows when that will happen but the odds are it will happen sometime this season.

2) Ramirez has been misused.   Sitting idle for 10 days and then pitching him vs the Indians who are contending team for a playoff spot is not very smart.   They have to get Ramirez starting every 5th day.   Then promote him to rotation.  Give him a try.  He has earned it.   Ramirez went 15-3 with a 3.47 ERA in 24 starts at AA in 2017.  He has a 3.40 ERA in 18 starts at AAA. And he has a 1.50 ERA at AAA Norfolk this season in 4 starts.    Yes he did not do well with the O's last season but this is a different team, different manager, different pitching coach.   He should be in line for a another chance at the rotation as soon as he is on a 5 day rotation at AAA and doing well.

3) Sean Gilmartin is being overlooked.  He was a #1 draft choice of Atlanta out of Florida State.   As a minor leaguer he has been traded,  Rule 5ed  and released.    He has a 12-11 record at AA with a 3.39 ERA in 32 starts and 191 IP.  His problem has been that he has not been successful in the PCL.   He and hundreds of others.   He has had two good stints in the majors as a reliever.  In 2015 with the Mets he went 3-2, with a 2.67 ERA in 57.1 IP.  And last season with the O's he  went 1-1 with 3.00 ERA in 27 IP.    He is not a flamethrower but he knows how to pitch.  And he is left-handed.  That probably kept him at Norfolk when Lucas was just recalled.   Hyde probably did not want 3 lefties in the pen with Fry and Bleier already here.  Gilmartin currently has a 2.31 ERA in 23.2 IP for the Tides. And he as one option left.

I say put Gilmartin in the rotation at Norfolk and see if he can still start.  Yes, he is 29 but that is who the O's want to promote  instead of Akin this season.  They don't want to start Akin's major league serve clock this season.

4) Ynoa was a thought  for the O's rotation.  He did  well in his first few games in the pen.  But now he has had three stinker in a row.  He has to pitch better in the pen before he gets a chance at the rotation.

[sportsfan8703]

We’re just seeing the lack of depth that Elias added in the offseason. Given that the MLB team was going to be a constant tryout for roster sports all season, Elias should have signed more MILB FAs that we’re looking for a shot in the big leagues. 

We’re just a mess. The best solution is to probably go with openers a lot then rotate through a bunch of optionable arms to try and piece together 8-9 innings. 

[LA2]

Thank you for these constructive thoughts. But in recent years, Gilmartin has been a disaster when given the chance to start. How does that change?

What would you do with Straily--demote, release, or 'pen him?

In your opinion, it is not too early in this lost year to already put Hess in the 'pen or demote or DFA him? Have you lost any hope that he can return to last year's second-half form?

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, LA2 said:

Thank you for these constructive thoughts. But in recent years, Gilmartin has been a disaster when given the chance to start. How does that change?

What would you do with Straily--demote, release, or 'pen him?

In your opinion, it is not too early in this lost year to already put Hess in the 'pen or demote or DFA him? Have you lost any hope that he can return to last year's second-half form?

There is not reason to DFA Hess.   He has options.  He might do already in the pen.   I looked at Hyde's presser after the game and the interview with Hess.   In both cases it seemed evident that at this point Hess should not be in the rotation.   They don't know how to fix his command problems.   Its probably hurting his confidence to keep him in the rotation.  He needs a break from the pressures of starting in the majors IMO.

Straily is just not good enough to start in the AL East.   His stuff does on play consistently. Or even often enough to be a good AL East starter.   He could go to the pen.  If they O's need the roster spot he could be DFA'd.    He is  not much help to the O's as a starter but he might have to stay there until they O's can get Cobb back and Ramirez ready for a rotation try.

As I stated, Gilmartin has not been successful starting  in the PCL.  That is the where the large majority of his starts that been in the recent years.   It may be harder to start in the PCL then in the majors.   Gilmartin has started 5 games at Norfolk over 2018-2019.   He has only been allowed to go 3 innings is each of those starts and he has a 2.40 ERA in 15 IP.  That is not much of a trial.

I am not saying that Gilmartin should be in the O's rotation now.  I am saying they should give him  a try in the Norfolk rotation and if he does well promote him to the O's.   He has pitched well in the majors as a reliever.   He has pitched well at AA  as a starter.  He is pitching well has a reliever at Norfolk now.  He has not been given a chance lately to be a starter in the International  league.  I think he deserves that chance considering the O's alternatives.

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We’re just seeing the lack of depth that Elias added in the offseason. Given that the MLB team was going to be a constant tryout for roster sports all season, Elias should have signed more MILB FAs that we’re looking for a shot in the big leagues. 

We’re just a mess. The best solution is to probably go with openers a lot then rotate through a bunch of optionable arms to try and piece together 8-9 innings. 

Nothing wrong with going to a opener to pitch a couple of innings but someone still needs to pitch a lot of innings in long relief if they do use the opener.

[Moose Milligan]

A lot of this, IMO, hinges on when/if Cobb comes back.  I'm not even sure what's wrong with the dude but if he can come back the issue with the rotation doesn't look as terrible as it does now.

When Cobb decides his hangnail or whatever's keeping him off the mound is better, I'd release Straily.  There's no need to keep him around.  An experiment gone wrong.

Hess...whatever.  Not a part of the future of this team.  I'd demote him but odds are he's going to get more starts.  I feel the same about Ramirez, AA and AAA starts be damned.  

@LA2 brings up a good point on Gilmartin given a chance to start and how that's gone in the past.  I'd give him a shot to start...why not?  But odds are it won't be good.  

These are only temporary fixes until they trade Cashner later this summer.  IMO, I hope they trade Bundy, too but I don't see that happening.

All of this is to say that it's going to be a patchwork rotation all season.  Cobb hasn't been healthy, Cashner is going to get traded most likely.  We are going to consistently have 2 or 3 spots in the rotation being cycled in and out for the rest of the summer unless they decide to keep Straily and Hess in there because there's no one else that's significantly better.

 

 

[theocean]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We’re just seeing the lack of depth that Elias added in the offseason. Given that the MLB team was going to be a constant tryout for roster sports all season, Elias should have signed more MILB FAs that we’re looking for a shot in the big leagues. 

We’re just a mess. The best solution is to probably go with openers a lot then rotate through a bunch of optionable arms to try and piece together 8-9 innings. 

I completely agree with this and have been shouting about this since Spring Training, all while getting called an unknowledgeable baseball fan on this board. I think Elias made a big error in not signing enough depth to get through the season - in terms of inexpensive veterans and minor league free agents. It's incredibly difficult for these guys, especially on the pitching side of things, to have any success when they're constantly pitching tired. It's difficult for Hyde to put guys in positions to succeed when he's just trying to move pieces around to get through games.

Hyde has practically said lately that they don't have enough depth, they don't have any veterans to lean on, and they are pretty much stuck with what they have. I don't really see what they can do besides move Hess to the bullpen and give Ynoa or Yefry Ramirez a shot. 

[Moose Milligan]

2 minutes ago, theocean said:

I completely agree with this and have been shouting about this since Spring Training, all while getting called an unknowledgeable baseball fan on this board. I think Elias made a big error in not signing enough depth to get through the season - in terms of inexpensive veterans and minor league free agents. It's incredibly difficult for these guys, especially on the pitching side of things, to have any success when they're constantly pitching tired. It's difficult for Hyde to put guys in positions to succeed when he's just trying to move pieces around to get through games.

Hyde has practically said lately that they don't have enough depth, they don't have any veterans to lean on, and they are pretty much stuck with what they have. I don't really see what they can do besides move Hess to the bullpen and give Ynoa or Yefry Ramirez a shot. 

Well, what is depth?  Is it a bunch of Straily types?  Cause that isn't appetizing.  

Or is "depth" a few layers of guys that can contribute in a positive way?  

[Going Underground]

1 hour ago, LA2 said:

Thank you for these constructive thoughts. But in recent years, Gilmartin has been a disaster when given the chance to start. How does that change?

What would you do with Straily--demote, release, or 'pen him?

In your opinion, it is not too early in this lost year to already put Hess in the 'pen or demote or DFA him? Have you lost any hope that he can return to last year's second-half form?

What happens if Strally escapes from the pen?  But Strally came here because of analytics and it is working so well. 

Dan Straily chose the Orioles as his late-spring free agency destination in part because of the opportunity presented here to step right into a starting rotation and the data-informed environment the organization seeks to foster under executive vice president/general manager Mike Elias and his top deputy, assistant general manager for analytics Sig Mejdal.

He has his own Rapsodo unit, which combines radar-readings and a camera to provide instant analysis on the spin and movement of a pitch, and he takes it on the road. He's trained at Driveline, a player-development facility that touts itself as one of the most progressive in the game.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/bs-sp-orioles-dan-straily-qa-20190521-story.html

 

[glenn__davis]

2 hours ago, wildcard said:

 Yes, he is 29 but that is who the O's want to promote  instead of Akin this season.  They don't want to start Akin's major league serve clock this season.

Do we know this?  Don't know that we've gotten much of a feel on how the new regime handles service clock time.  I would hope that they just want Akin to continue to develop a bit more.  I wouldn't worry much about service clock for pitchers.  His last few starts have been pretty good. If he puts together a solid run of starts I'd like to see him up here.

[eddie83]

8 minutes ago, glenn__davis said:

Do we know this?  Don't know that we've gotten much of a feel on how the new regime handles service clock time.  I would hope that they just want Akin to continue to develop a bit more.  I wouldn't worry much about service clock for pitchers.  His last few starts have been pretty good. If he puts together a solid run of starts I'd like to see him up here.

I don’t think Akin is someone they would do this with anyway. He isn’t a young David Price.  

Like you said, about development.

[eddie83]

They do have a decent number of off days coming up. 

 

[Moose Milligan]

Just now, eddie83 said:

They do have a decent number of off days coming up. 

 

Thank God.  Don't have to watch the embarrassment.  Can go see John Wick 3 and do some other stuff.

[DrungoHazewood]

There's nothing wrong with the rotation that three or four years of drafting, signing, and development won't help.

[eddie83]

6 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Thank God.  Don't have to watch the embarrassment.  Can go see John Wick 3 and do some other stuff.

Off May 30, June 3,10, 24 and 27.