Raw Story: Covid19 Destruction of the Minor Leagues.

[Redskins Rick]

16 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

There are a lot of factors.  In the 1950s clearly TV had a huge impact.  The 1948 Indians drew 2.6 million fans, which was the record for decades.  Cleveland was still a fairly large industrial city (about 900k people, 7th in the US), prior to the rust belt, but it wasn't some kind of high-income metropolis.  In 1958 they drew 660k fans.  The Yankees' attendance fell by almost half in that same period.  The '55 Senators drew 425,000 fans, or 5500 a game.  That's less than the Hartford Yard Goats drew last year.

Transportation was different, cars less reliable, efficient, and fewer of them per household.  People were fleeing cities for the suburbs in the 50s.  Stadiums were mostly 30, 40, 50 years old with few amenities, no parking, and often bad sight lines.  We romanticize places like Ebbets Field or the Polo Grounds but they were generations older than Memorial Stadium, which was pretty outdated when I went there in the 80s and early 90s.

In 1950 and 1960 the average MLB ticket was between $1.50 and $2.00, compared to over $20 today.  Which is fairly in line with inflation, a $1.50 in 1950 is about $16.00 today.

I had similar experiences growing up.  My Dad was a government engineer and project manager, making a solid GS-13 salary and we went out to eat a few times a year.  We made it to one or two Orioles games a year, and we're about two hours from Baltimore.  When he was a kid in the 50s I don't know that it ever occurred to them to go to DC or Baltimore to a ballgame, but they were three or four hours away, and lower-middle class farmers.  But clearly the population had the capacity to draw 2M+ to a some city's baseball games, if the external factors cooperated.

Although in 1978 the Orioles' all time attendance record for a season was 1.203M fans, in 1966.  Or 100k less than the '19 Orioles.

Woe, Dad was a GS-13 too, made grade pretty fast and then plateaued there until he retired. 

Now that you mentioned it, I think we got to about 3 Senator games a season, probably one a month in June, July and August. Almost always on a give away day.

Compared to some stadiums like Memorial Park, RFK had relatively decent parking situation and was pretty brand new. Built in 61.

Back then, we didnt care about megatron scoreboards and other amenities, of course, now that we have them, how did we live without them.

[DrungoHazewood]

1 minute ago, Redskins Rick said:

Back then, we didnt care about megatron scoreboards and other amenities, of course, now that we have them, how did we live without them.

I think there's a lesson to be learned, that the ballclubs figured out 20 or 30 years ago: If you're just selling baseball games you'll draw 10,000 or 15,000 fans a game most years in most cities.  But if you're selling baseball with exploding scoreboards and lots of food options and club level amenities, and mascots, and between inning entertainment, and big stores with team gear, and comfortable seats... then you might draw 25k or 30k or more.

The growth in attendance from the 70s to the 2000s wasn't people who keep score and post on the Hangout and can't wait for Ryan Mountcastle to show up.  It's people who want slushees and Korean tacos and a new hat.

[Redskins Rick]

23 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Fun fact of the day: the 1935 St. Louis Browns drew 80,922 fans, or 1065 per game.  Supporting a payroll of approximately $108,000. 

I don't know how they didn't go bankrupt.  Tickets had to be 50 cents.  They probably only made payroll based on revenue from advertising signs on the outfield fence and ads in the program.  And beer.

Wonder if like little league, the managers did the caulk lines, and even cut the grass. LOL

[DrungoHazewood]

Just now, Redskins Rick said:

Wonder if like little league, the managers did the caulk lines, and even cut the grass. LOL

Even in the 1890s the Orioles had a full-time groundskeeper.  Thomas Murphy.  Lived in a little apartment in a shack on the Union Park grounds.  The NL Orioles' max attendance was 328k in 1894.  He's the one who put soap flakes around the mound, and told the O's pitchers to keep some dirt in their pocket so the ball wouldn't get slippery.

[weams]

4 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I think there's a lesson to be learned, that the ballclubs figured out 20 or 30 years ago: If you're just selling baseball games you'll draw 10,000 or 15,000 fans a game most years in most cities.  But if you're selling baseball with exploding scoreboards and lots of food options and club level amenities, and mascots, and between inning entertainment, and big stores with team gear, and comfortable seats... then you might draw 25k or 30k or more.

The growth in attendance from the 70s to the 2000s wasn't people who keep score and post on the Hangout and can't wait for Ryan Mountcastle to show up.  It's people who want slushees and Korean tacos and a new hat.

New Hat!

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, weams said:

New Hat!

Short rib tacos.

[weams]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Short rib tacos.

That old Texas stadium (which I think was also called Globe Life in its death throes) had food that was celebratory. Bigger. Better.  Texas. 

[DrungoHazewood]

7 minutes ago, weams said:

That old Texas stadium (which I think was also called Globe Life in its death throes) had food that was celebratory. Bigger. Better.  Texas. 

That old Texas stadium that opened in 1994.  I understand building a new stadium every 10 or 20 years when the old one is made of wood and seats 6500 and the old one caught fire.  But when the old one is concrete and steel and has luxury boxes and cost $329 million and the taxpayers foot the bill?

[weams]

5 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

That old Texas stadium that opened in 1994.  I understand building a new stadium every 10 or 20 years when the old one is made of wood and seats 6500 and the old one caught fire.  But when the old one is concrete and steel and has luxury boxes and cost $329 million and the taxpayers foot the bill?

They forgot to put a roof on it in 1994 and then temperatures went up 20 degrees. 

[Redskins Rick]

17 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

That old Texas stadium that opened in 1994.  I understand building a new stadium every 10 or 20 years when the old one is made of wood and seats 6500 and the old one caught fire.  But when the old one is concrete and steel and has luxury boxes and cost $329 million and the taxpayers foot the bill?

Better to waste money that way, then spending 4 Billion to a Chinese lab so they can play with Bats.

[DrungoHazewood]

12 hours ago, weams said:

They forgot to put a roof on it in 1994 and then temperatures went up 20 degrees. 

Couldn't you buy a Zeppelin (cost $21m) and have it fly around blocking the sun?  That would be a lot cheaper than a new stadium.

[weams]

3 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Couldn't you buy a Zeppelin (cost $21m) and have it fly around blocking the sun?  That would be a lot cheaper than a new stadium.

It's that "conditioned air" that they are after. 

[Redskins Rick]

31 minutes ago, weams said:

It's that "conditioned air" that they are after. 

Between the AC and your own private bathroom. I would watch every game live, if I could afford a luxury box. LOL

[DrungoHazewood]

55 minutes ago, weams said:

It's that "conditioned air" that they are after. 

Wusses.  They should be forced to go 81 day games in a suit and bowler hat. 

That's why even the Yanks sometimes barely drew 1M fans a year prior to lights.  You have to be a little addled in the brain to sit in the sun in dress clothes watching a 60-win St. Louis Browns or Washington Senators team.

[Redskins Rick]

34 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Wusses.  They should be forced to go 81 day games in a suit and bowler hat. 

That's why even the Yanks sometimes barely drew 1M fans a year prior to lights.  You have to be a little addled in the brain to sit in the sun in dress clothes watching a 60-win St. Louis Browns or Washington Senators team.

I remember the old style wool like baseball uniforms, hot and itchy, how the heck could they play in those?????