MLB Lockout Thread

[Frobby]

6 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

I am far more certain about that than you are.  I believe that if the owners ended the lockout now and there was no CBA in place by September, the players would strike then and threaten the playoffs.  The owners figured there would be a work stoppage and decide to control the timing of that stoppage.  I’m not pro owner, but I don’t blame them for taking that step.

I didn’t say I blamed them.   From a fan’s perspective, I’d rather miss games at the beginning of the season than at the end.    And of course, I’d rather miss no games at all.   I do blame the owners for going 43 days before making their initial offer.    But there’s plenty of blame to go around for how these negotiations have been conducted.   

[Too Tall]

Another question. If this drags out, do you think the union will try to negatively influence/affect minor league play in any way as a pressure tactic? Do they have any way to even do that. I see this getting uglier. I am looking forward to the start of the minor league season - IT"S BASEBALL  -  ORIOLE BASEBALL!!!

[Pickles]

3 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

So?

Doesn't mean they would be opposed to playing out the season under the current deal.

Or they could sign the paper in front of them and just play ball.

Now, that's not a fair expectation, but neither is putting all the blame on the owners, regardless of the lockout.

As said above, there's plenty of blame to go around.

[Sports Guy]

 

[Pickles]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

It’s still the owners who have stopped the season from progressing in the normal way.   I’m not saying that because I side with the players in the negotiation, it’s just the fact.  If the owners hadn’t imposed a lockout, would the players have staged a strike?   Maybe, but we don’t really know.   

I don't think we really disagree about the situation.

Both parties shoulder blame. 

[Sports Guy]

 

[jabba72]

51 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

 

So they plan on having a week of daily negotiations to try and get an agreement by the 28th. Not ideal, unless you think a month of spring training is plenty of time. 

[Sports Guy]

Just now, jabba72 said:

So they plan on having a week of daily negotiations to try and get an agreement by the 28th. Not ideal, unless you think a month of spring training is plenty of time. 

That’s what they have said…need 4 weeks.  That’s all.

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, jabba72 said:

So they plan on having a week of daily negotiations to try and get an agreement by the 28th. Not ideal, unless you think a month of spring training is plenty of time. 

For established players?  Sure its enough.

Young guys that are on the 40, like Hall. Those it will hurt a bit.

[24fps]

A plague on both their houses.  Pun (or whatever it is) fully intended.

SEC baseball begins February 18 and I live 20 miles from Vanderbilt.  The sport will be considerably more engaging than watching multi-millionaires argue with billionaires about whose grievance is more worthy of relief.

[NCRaven]

5 hours ago, Frobby said:

 I do blame the owners for going 43 days before making their initial offer.    But there’s plenty of blame to go around for how these negotiations have been conducted.   

On this we can agree.

[OriolesMagic83]

I just realized that the union's initial proposal was for all players to hit arbitration after 2 years.  The pre-arbitration money was to split among year 1 and 2 players.  The owner's proposal was no change to super 2's, I believe, and $10 million in pre arbitration money to players in year 1, 2, and 3.  The sides aren't on the same page, they might not even be in the same book.  I can't see this being resolved any time soon. 

[LookinUp]

10 hours ago, jabba72 said:

So they plan on having a week of daily negotiations to try and get an agreement by the 28th. Not ideal, unless you think a month of spring training is plenty of time. 

I've got a contrarian take on all of this...

It's normal. There's a time for business and there's a time for games. This is a time for business. It doesn't mean that they don't love the game. It doesn't mean that either side is greedier than the other. It doesn't mean they don't care about fans. It's just a scheduled time to divvy up billions of dollars.

Why not sooner? Because it's a negotiation, not a playground game. Negotiations are often deadline driven. It's why the trade deadline is often craziest in the hours before it passes. And this isn't a matter of public safety like some master labor negotiations. It's about a game. 

So what's happening isn't indicative of anything in my opinion other than two parties handling their business on a very predictable timeline. It's quite possible that one holds out and is willing to lose some games, but I'd say unlikely this go around. If it does happen, the delay will be short.

[Tony-OH]

17 hours ago, Frobby said:

It seems like each side feels they will gain the advantage once regular season games are at risk, so neither side is motivated to push this along.   The pace is really maddening.   

I agree. Right now, they are just thinking, we'll miss some spring training games (which honestly are too many and go on for too long) so they have no interest in moving off their positions. I do however think mediation could help. 

[Tony-OH]

16 hours ago, NCRaven said:

I am far more certain about that than you are.  I believe that if the owners ended the lockout now and there was no CBA in place by September, the players would strike then and threaten the playoffs.  The owners figured there would be a work stoppage and decide to control the timing of that stoppage.  I’m not pro owner, but I don’t blame them for taking that step.

After what the MLBPA pulled in 2004, the owners can never allow a possibility of a mid-season strike again. As far apart as they are in their positions, a lockout made the most sense from their perspective.

While I've been critical of the MLBPA, and rightly so in my opinion, the owners have to realize that they need to get more money into the hands of the producing young players if they want a system that won't force them into signing mediocre middle aged players for insane amounts.