Have We Reached Our High Water Mark?

[forphase1]

28 minutes ago, Brooks The Great said:

I love the job Elias has done, but not calling up Henderson by now to improve the lineup (and the defense) is a mistake on Elias' part. It makes no sense to wait any longer if the primary objective is to make the playoffs, which is what the objective needs to be.

I don't disagree, but I'm not sure that's the primary objective.  I think the primary objective is to make the playoffs without doing anything to harm the long term future of the franchise.  Which, at least I think in Elias belief, includes not using a needed resources (service time, 40 man spots, not just now, but to have room to protect folks in the offseason, etc) chasing the last playoff spot.  I am not sure I agree with that line of thinking, but at least I can understand it.  We have been bad for SO long, all of us fans want to see us make the playoffs, this year, ahead of schedule.  But Elias is taking a much longer term viewpoint than most of us.  And, frustratingly, he may be right.  

Trust me, I want Henderson here.  Anything that keep Nevin and Odor on the bench or better yet off the roster is a move I'd support.  But there are considerations beyond our attempts to make the postseason to consider.  

[Sports Guy]

4 hours ago, forphase1 said:

I don't disagree, but I'm not sure that's the primary objective.  I think the primary objective is to make the playoffs without doing anything to harm the long term future of the franchise.  Which, at least I think in Elias belief, includes not using a needed resources (service time, 40 man spots, not just now, but to have room to protect folks in the offseason, etc) chasing the last playoff spot.  I am not sure I agree with that line of thinking, but at least I can understand it.  We have been bad for SO long, all of us fans want to see us make the playoffs, this year, ahead of schedule.  But Elias is taking a much longer term viewpoint than most of us.  And, frustratingly, he may be right.  

Trust me, I want Henderson here.  Anything that keep Nevin and Odor on the bench or better yet off the roster is a move I'd support.  But there are considerations beyond our attempts to make the postseason to consider.  

All of the excuses are over with though and they obviously shouldn’t be concerned about the 40 man spot.

[Can_of_corn]

4 hours ago, forphase1 said:

I don't disagree, but I'm not sure that's the primary objective.  I think the primary objective is to make the playoffs without doing anything to harm the long term future of the franchise.  Which, at least I think in Elias belief, includes not using a needed resources (service time, 40 man spots, not just now, but to have room to protect folks in the offseason, etc) chasing the last playoff spot.  I am not sure I agree with that line of thinking, but at least I can understand it.  We have been bad for SO long, all of us fans want to see us make the playoffs, this year, ahead of schedule.  But Elias is taking a much longer term viewpoint than most of us.  And, frustratingly, he may be right.  

Trust me, I want Henderson here.  Anything that keep Nevin and Odor on the bench or better yet off the roster is a move I'd support.  But there are considerations beyond our attempts to make the postseason to consider.  

Back before the 2019 season if you had heard the O's would be 64-59 in 2022 and within striking distance of the last wildcard spot would you say that was ahead of schedule or would you say that sounds about right?

I think where we are now is right for year four.  Elias has just done such a great job at lowering expectations.

[forphase1]

2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Back before the 2019 season if you had heard the O's would be 64-59 in 2022 and within striking distance of the last wildcard spot would you say that was ahead of schedule or would you say that sounds about right?

I think where we are now is right for year four.  Elias has just done such a great job at lowering expectations.

I'd say we are a bit ahead of schedule.  Our franchise sucked, the minors didn't have much talent and the MLB team was a mess.  I knew it would take a while for the kids we drafted and the international signings to start positively impacting our MLB team.  Other than obviously AR, much of our success this year has been from reclaiming scraps from other teams, tweaking them a bit, then letting them succeed.  I doubt any of us could have accurate predicted that to happen in the fashion it has.  

[forphase1]

2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

All of the excuses are over with though and they obviously shouldn’t be concerned about the 40 man spot.

Management should ALWAYS be concerned and/or mindful of how to juggle 40 man spots.  Using them foolishly ends up costing talent like Pop.  I know some are in a 'win now no matter the cost' mode, but thankfully Elias is looking long term.  Yes, if I was in charge I'd likely bring up the kids too and see what we can do this year, cut Nevin and Odor and go for it.  But I'm a fan, not a GM, and a GM should take a bigger picture outlook IMO.  We will soon be facing some serious 40 man crunches as we've a ton of talent we need to start protecting.  I can at least understand the logic behind not using those 40 man spots chasing something that may not be very likely.  Not sure I agree 100%, but I can understand it.  

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

Management should ALWAYS be concerned and/or mindful of how to juggle 40 man spots.  Using them foolishly ends up costing talent like Pop.  I know some are in a 'win now no matter the cost' mode, but thankfully Elias is looking long term.  Yes, if I was in charge I'd likely bring up the kids too and see what we can do this year, cut Nevin and Odor and go for it.  But I'm a fan, not a GM, and a GM should take a bigger picture outlook IMO.  We will soon be facing some serious 40 man crunches as we've a ton of talent we need to start protecting.  I can at least understand the logic behind not using those 40 man spots chasing something that may not be very likely.  Not sure I agree 100%, but I can understand it.  

The Orioles currently have anywhere from 10-15 guys they can cut from the 40 man roster that they won’t miss.(whether it’s now or the offseason)

They only need to add about 6 or so guys this offseason.

There is plenty of 40 man space and no issues long term with it.  

Edited August 25, 2022 by Sports Guy

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

Management should ALWAYS be concerned and/or mindful of how to juggle 40 man spots.  Using them foolishly ends up costing talent like Pop.  I know some are in a 'win now no matter the cost' mode, but thankfully Elias is looking long term.  Yes, if I was in charge I'd likely bring up the kids too and see what we can do this year, cut Nevin and Odor and go for it.  But I'm a fan, not a GM, and a GM should take a bigger picture outlook IMO.  We will soon be facing some serious 40 man crunches as we've a ton of talent we need to start protecting.  I can at least understand the logic behind not using those 40 man spots chasing something that may not be very likely.  Not sure I agree 100%, but I can understand it.  

I would have rather kept Pop but let's be serious.  He's a bullpen guy on his fourth franchise at 25.

You don't become paralyzed into inactivity over the fear of losing a Pop.

[Moshagge3]

It took them five tries, but they made it to seven games over the .500 mark. As best as I can tell, the last time they were seven games over was May 22, 2017. They lost to the Twins and someone named Stefan Crichton that I have absolutely no memory of pitched in relief.

[Frobby]

9 hours ago, Moshagge3 said:

It took them five tries, but they made it to seven games over the .500 mark. As best as I can tell, the last time they were seven games over was May 22, 2017. They lost to the Twins and someone named Stefan Crichton that I have absolutely no memory of pitched in relief.

That 2017 team fooled me pretty badly.  They roared off to a 22-10 start and somewhere around then I posted a thread asking if this was Buck’s best Orioles team.  They then proceeded to go 9-22 over their next 31 games to fall under .500.    

[Frobby]

On 8/25/2022 at 7:34 AM, Can_of_corn said:

Back before the 2019 season if you had heard the O's would be 64-59 in 2022 and within striking distance of the last wildcard spot would you say that was ahead of schedule or would you say that sounds about right?

I think where we are now is right for year four.  Elias has just done such a great job at lowering expectations.

I agree the team is about where I’d hoped it would be if you’d asked me before the 2019 season.  The path there has been a little different than what I expected.   I didn’t anticipate a pandemic interfering with the team’s development plans, and even considering that, I didn’t expect the team to be as bad as it was in 2021.   So in that sense, 2022 is a pleasant surprise from the perspective of where we seemed to be last year, but not from what I would have expected before the 2019 season.  

Of course, not all rebuilds work.   This one appears to be working, so I’m happy about that.   But we’ll see if they continue to progress next year.

 

[Frobby]

+8.  

[tntoriole]

At this point .. 85 wins would be in one way a letdown as it means going 18-18 the rest of the way .. 23-13 gets us to 90 wins .. let’s go!! 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, tntoriole said:

At this point .. 85 wins would be in one way a letdown as it means going 18-18 the rest of the way .. 23-13 gets us to 90 wins .. let’s go!! 

I would in no way feel let down by this team winning 85 games this season.

 

[tntoriole]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I would in no way feel let down by this team winning 85 games this season.

 

Certainly not … maybe letdown is not the right word … ummmmm “left grateful and still wanting the miracle” 

[Bahama O's Fan]

8 games above .500 now. Highest point for the season, right?