Jorge Mateo 2023

[Aristotelian]

When do they announce AL Player of the Month?

[Punchandjudy]

9 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

I think you only move Mateo at this point for a young TOR or major league ready TOR potential starter, but I'm not sure he's going to get that.

Right now, with his adjustments a the plate, it's hard to think about moving him when he's playing like the best player in baseball. Do I think the Orioles have a replacement ready in Ortiz? Yes. But I'd much rather have Ortiz playing next to him at 2B and have two SSs playing up the middle. 

Unless the Orioles crash and are out of it by the trade deadline (doubtful), Mateo should be this team's everyday SS this year. Henderson should basically platoon with Urias at 3B with Urias picking up extra playing time at 2B. 

Right on.  Mateo is going to have his doubters all year wrong, but he looks every part. I love Ortiz and agree that putting him at second could make for a special double play combination (modern day Trammel-Whitikar?).  Henderson is an interesting case.  He probably would benefit from being sent down to work on his breaking ball recognition and left on left hitting…maybe give Westerburg a look see/audition? But he certainly has the talent to be on the major league roster.  Can’t argue there are better options right now for the AB’s with Urias hitting. Good place to be but at some point you need to identify some talent to move for pitching. 

[Il BuonO]

1 hour ago, Bemorewins said:

Which part? 

Eh, the part yesterday where you were impassioned that Mateo is a nugget and shouldn’t be traded. Then, today you were quite adamant that Cease was a target worthy of trading away Mateo. Those things are very different. 

[Billy F-Face3]

MLB Network did a great segment on Jorge Mateo, based off of the article written in the Baltimore Sun...

 

[Bemorewins]

7 hours ago, Il BuonO said:

Eh, the part yesterday where you were impassioned that Mateo is a nugget and shouldn’t be traded. Then, today you were quite adamant that Cease was a target worthy of trading away Mateo. Those things are very different. 

I think you have me confused with someone else or misunderstood my post.
 

I said Mateo is a nugget and believe that he should be left alone until Holiday is ready. He wouldn’t be any part of a Cease trade. Why would the CHI Sox want him? If they were trade Cease it would be for younger pieces. What I was referring to is if we had to trade Gunnar Henderson as part of the package. I believe the CHI Sox would be much more interested in a player like him. I don’t and wouldn’t want to trade Gunnar, but as much I believe in his talent and future, he is replaceable from the standpoint that we have a player with a similar profile in Holiday (left handed hitting, 5-tool SS, with elite plate discipline). But what we don’t have is a player like Cease. Yes Grayson has the profile, pitch arsenal, and talent of a #1, but I believe that it’s going to take more than that in order for us to win this October or any other going forward. I don’t have a lot of confidence in Bradish, Kremer, or Gibson to start postseason games. And I feel like Means is very much a wildcard this year. The rest of our team is too good to go into a postseason with kind of disadvantage at starting pitcher. One last thing, while I would be very happen to acquire a pitcher like Cease, I also stated that I’m not married to the idea that it has to be him. If we could get Alcantara or Luzardo from MIA or another pitcher could can slot into a game #1 for us. I do believe that this season those opportunities will be rare because most of the teams at the bottom of the standings don’t have players that we would want or need. But Cease may be one of those guys given how bad Chicago is.

These have been my sentiments in the thread and a few others…lol

[Moose Milligan]

In case anyone's confused@Bemorewinsreally likes Dylan Cease.

[pdiddy]

6 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

MLB Network did a great segment on Jorge Mateo, based off of the article written in the Baltimore Sun...

 

Thanks for posting this - I never watch but if they are doing more like this that’s pretty great. Does anyone have the link to the Sun article?

[Mooreisbetter27]

6 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

MLB Network did a great segment on Jorge Mateo, based off of the article written in the Baltimore Sun...

 

I really enjoy seeing this analyzed in video.  I read the Sun article and I liked what I read but I wasn't 100% sure the differences visually.  Seeing it like this is great to be able to understand the modifications on a visual level.  

[Bemorewins]

1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

In case anyone's confused@Bemorewinsreally likes Dylan Cease.

HA HA ... I do! But I also like Alcantara and Luzardo. Or pretty much any very good pitcher who can anchor the front of our rotation...lol

With a team as prospect rich as we are, the sky is the limit! There's no one that we can't get (if available).

[Tony-OH]

Doing some work:

[SpOkane]

Just now, Tony-OH said:

Doing some work:

Now you convinced me, Volpe is starting the All-Star game at SS. 

[Bemorewins]

8 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

MLB Network did a great segment on Jorge Mateo, based off of the article written in the Baltimore Sun...

 

This is PROOF positive numero uno why it would be ludicrous even to consider trading this guy! We he be .347 good all season? No way! 

But we can clearly see the the results that he is getting is not based on luck. But they are do to a change that was made to the swing. PLUS they didn't even talk about the much improved swing decisions. When you add his ELITE speed and the defense (though it has been up and down a little in the early going) folks we have the makings of something special in him!

We don't need him to be this version of himself for another 5-10 years. All we need is something even remotely close to this for a season and a half at most until Holiday is ready. That's when you consider trading him. I never understood the logic in moving him for a prospect(s) and inserting Ortiz in his place. That makes us not only worse for this year, but then you still have the problem of replacing one prospect for another next year. Why not take one prospect and move them considering we don't currently have a Mateo on our starting staff. That is to say a guy performing at an ELITE MVP level. Grayson will get there in time (hopefully). But in order to become pennant winners, we will need more. 

[Tony-OH]

38 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

This is PROOF positive numero uno why it would be ludicrous even to consider trading this guy! We he be .347 good all season? No way! 

But we can clearly see the the results that he is getting is not based on luck. But they are do to a change that was made to the swing. PLUS they didn't even talk about the much improved swing decisions. When you add his ELITE speed and the defense (though it has been up and down a little in the early going) folks we have the makings of something special in him!

We don't need him to be this version of himself for another 5-10 years. All we need is something even remotely close to this for a season and a half at most until Holiday is ready. That's when you consider trading him. I never understood the logic in moving him for a prospect(s) and inserting Ortiz in his place. That makes us not only worse for this year, but then you still have the problem of replacing one prospect for another next year. Why not take one prospect and move them considering we don't currently have a Mateo on our starting staff. That is to say a guy performing at an ELITE MVP level. Grayson will get there in time (hopefully). But in order to become pennant winners, we will need more. 

Coming into the season, Henderson was the logical replacement for Mateo if he struggled offensively, with Ortiz and the tertiary option at SS. I think it's fairly clear that with his swing adjustments that he's pretty well set as the everyday SS for the foreseeable future. It would be quite the surprise if he keeps up his torrid pace, but there is hope that at worse he's a .750 OPS guy with speed and power and if with his defense, that's still all-star caliber.

Obviously my preference is for Ortiz to play at second base for now, though I do think ultimately Ortiz could be a trade chip for a starter, especially since Holliday is probably only a few years away.  

[Bemorewins]

47 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Coming into the season, Henderson was the logical replacement for Mateo if he struggled offensively, with Ortiz and the tertiary option at SS. I think it's fairly clear that with his swing adjustments that he's pretty well set as the everyday SS for the foreseeable future. It would be quite the surprise if he keeps up his torrid pace, but there is hope that at worse he's a .750 OPS guy with speed and power and if with his defense, that's still all-star caliber.

Obviously my preference is for Ortiz to play at second base for now, though I do think ultimately Ortiz could be a trade chip for a starter, especially since Holliday is probably only a few years away.  

Tony, I trust your acumen when it comes to evaluating any Orioles prospect above anyone else. I only signed up for an account on this board last year, but I have been reading this board since the days when Reimold was a prospect.

I know that you prefer Ortiz at 2B. But my question is who do you think that other teams see as having more value, Ortiz, Westburg, or Norby? I think the answer to that question may determine who stays and who goes. But I agree they all cannot stay. There is no place to fit them in our infield. And even with RF coming open sooner, that looks like it will belong to Cowser. And 1B/DH will probably be split between Mountcastle and Kjerstad.

[Tony-OH]

5 hours ago, Bemorewins said:

Tony, I trust your acumen when it comes to evaluating any Orioles prospect above anyone else. I only signed up for an account on this board last year, but I have been reading this board since the days when Reimold was a prospect.

I know that you prefer Ortiz at 2B. But my question is who do you think that other teams see as having more value, Ortiz, Westburg, or Norby? I think the answer to that question may determine who stays and who goes. But I agree they all cannot stay. There is no place to fit them in our infield. And even with RF coming open sooner, that looks like it will belong to Cowser. And 1B/DH will probably be split between Mountcastle and Kjerstad.

Thanks for the kind words.

Just to be clear, I prefer Ortiz at 2B on this team over Frazier, only because Mateo is at SS. He's a legitimate major league defensive SS in his own right.

As for who has more value, it depends on what the team's need are that are looking to acquire one of them. Ortiz is the best defender by far and while his bat may be close to Westburg, I give Westburg's bat the edge because of his power potential. Norby is in a bit of a funk right now, but I do think his bat will play in the major leagues when it's all said and done. Unfortunately, his defense at 2B, while not terrible, is below average. 

If a team wants an all-around SS, Ortiz is your guy. If a team is looking for a bat first infielder who can play all three infield positions (and probably 1B with a little experience) then Westburg is your guy. Norby to me is a step under the other two because of his defensive concerns.