A Realistic Pitching Ace And What It Will Take to Acquire Him

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, MCO'sFan said:

Plus, Ohtani is staying out west. It will be the Dodgers or the Angels with SF as a dark horse. I can't see anyone else signing him. 

Seattle could.

[MCO'sFan]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Seattle could.

They could but I don't think they would. That's an awful lot of money and they seemed to be staying away from the top tier FAs. Perhaps they are doing that so the CAN make a run at Ohtani. What do I know? I am just guessing anyway. 

[Bemorewins]

14 minutes ago, MCO'sFan said:

Plus, Ohtani is staying out west. It will be the Dodgers or the Angels with SF as a dark horse. I can't see anyone else signing him. 

Given that the Mets owner has WAY MORE money than every other owner, I would put the Angels or Giants anywhere close to being in front of them. It is very likely that Steve Cohen makes a play for him in FA.

[MCO'sFan]

It has been said that he wants to stay on the west coast which is why I excluded a;; east coast teams including the NYY and NYM. But maybe there is enough money to persuade him.

[OriolesMagic83]

12 hours ago, DirtyBird said:

We should get Goldschmidt. Our pitching will be fine.

The O's should jump on trading for Goldshmidt, that would make our offense elite.  Obviously Mountcastle and prospects going back.  I checked and he's only signed thru 2024 at $22 mill/yr.  I can already hear Angelos whining about how the O's can't compete w/ big market teams.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

The O's should jump on trading for Goldshmidt, that would make our offense elite.  Obviously Mountcastle and prospects going back.  I checked and he's only signed thru 2024 at $22 mill/yr.  I can already hear Angelos whining about how the O's can't compete w/ big market teams.

Cards are only five out after going on a big time heater.

I don't think they are currently planning to sell.

[btdart20]

To toss a few more names at various price points into the Groupthink arena:

KC's Brady Singer - Not much to like other than the low cost of admission and some regression to mean.  FA in 2027.  2 options.  

Gnats' MacKenzie Gore - Statcast is Mardi Gras Red Light District.  More costly, but not in the Cease/Burns tax bracket.  FA eligible in 2028.  3 options.

Rockies' Kyle Freeland - already matches the O's pitching philosophy of low BB%.  Some tricks and some treats on his page.  OPACY (and nearly every other park) would make the top line stats (like HR allowed) look much better than what Coors provides (like 3 expected HR allowed vs. his actual 8 allowed).  He's under contract through 2026 (2027 vesting option) for about $13m/year.  

[Bemorewins]

38 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

The O's should jump on trading for Goldshmidt, that would make our offense elite.  Obviously Mountcastle and prospects going back.  I checked and he's only signed thru 2024 at $22 mill/yr.  I can already hear Angelos whining about how the O's can't compete w/ big market teams.

IMO - the offense is already good enough to win the big prize... the starting pitching is not. We will not go into the post season as favorites (regardless of regular season record) with the starting staff as currently constructed (even if you add Means and whatever we may or may not get from him). 

I would love to have Goldschmidt, but it seems starting pitching is more of the priority if we have to pick one.

[Bemorewins]

13 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

To toss a few more names at various price points into the Groupthink arena:

KC's Brady Singer - Not much to like other than the low cost of admission and some regression to mean.  FA in 2027.  2 options.  

Gnats' MacKenzie Gore - Statcast is Mardi Gras Red Light District.  More costly, but not in the Cease/Burns tax bracket.  FA eligible in 2028.  3 options.

Rockies' Kyle Freeland - already matches the O's pitching philosophy of low BB%.  Some tricks and some treats on his page.  OPACY (and nearly every other park) would make the top line stats (like HR allowed) look much better than what Coors provides (like 3 expected HR allowed vs. his actual 8 allowed).  He's under contract through 2026 (2027 vesting option) for about $13m/year.  

I believe that is exactly the tax bracket we should be in and where we should be shopping. (Not necessarily those 2 guys, but guys of that caliber).

We NEED and have the prospect ammunition in abundance, to acquire a difference making type starting pitcher; preferably a guy who has MORE than 1 season on his contract. Because the hole at the type of rotation will probably be here for the foreseeable (even as Grayson develops) IMO you need more than 1 to get all the way through the AL and then beat the likes of LAD or ATL.

Gore/Singer/Freeland are not really the type of players who significantly change the odds in our favor, like say what HOU did when they acquired Verlander or what WAS did when they acquired Scherzer.   

[Dunk35]

14 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

Let's  just assume that any player in MLB is available and you could DRAFT 1 starting pitcher. What's your wish-list shortlist look like? Who's number 1 on your pitchers wish-list?

I know his stats don't look good but going forward, Alcantara. The stuff, body type, age, track record. 

[Bahama O's Fan]

The thing to remember is that we are only the 2nd best team in baseball NOW. Once we near the trade deadline, every other contender is going to improve their team. We cannot play with the big boys if we don't do the same. 

[btdart20]

1 hour ago, Bemorewins said:

I believe that is exactly the tax bracket we should be in and where we should be shopping. (Not necessarily those 2 guys, but guys of that caliber).

We NEED and have the prospect ammunition in abundance, to acquire a difference making type starting pitcher; preferably a guy who has MORE than 1 season on his contract. Because the hole at the type of rotation will probably be here for the foreseeable (even as Grayson develops) IMO you need more than 1 to get all the way through the AL and then beat the likes of LAD or ATL.

Gore/Singer/Freeland are not really the type of players who significantly change the odds in our favor, like say what HOU did when they acquired Verlander or what WAS did when they acquired Scherzer.   

No doubt Cease/Burns are bigger difference makers when healthy.  That's not the case to be made in targeting any of these SPs.  I'm just tossing out other options in case Elias doesn't want to burn through the prospect clip for one risk bucket.  Gore and Freeland could be a second get if he does want to unload a bunch of prospects.  I'm not trying to change your opinion, just spit balling options.

[Bemorewins]

25 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

No doubt Cease/Burns are bigger difference makers when healthy.  That's not the case to be made in targeting any of these SPs.  I'm just tossing out other options in case Elias doesn't want to burn through the prospect clip for one risk bucket.  Gore and Freeland could be a second get if he does want to unload a bunch of prospects.  I'm not trying to change your opinion, just spit balling options.

Gotcha... It's a thought that I had as well in terms of what if Elias decided to acquire 2 starting pitchers instead of just one?

Like if we could get Eduardo (not sure that the Tigers will trade him considering that "they are still in it in the Central") and say a Cease or a Luzardo? Not only would we enter this coming post season as the favorites, we would be an Eduardo Rodriguez resigning away from being the favorites next year and probably other years in the immediate future as well. And it would all be 'very affordable' in terms of prospect costs (maybe Rodriguez costs one top 100 guy given his opt-out contract status) and (maybe the other pitcher 2 top 100 guys plus one or 2 other prospects)? 

I know some will say "no way" you can't give up any prospects (except that guys who are fringe top 100 or whoever that persons that particularly like) but you have to give in order to get. And right now we have way too many positional prospects and not enough pitching to excel in the Fall IMO.

It's just a thought as well, but it's not to be in this kind of position that we can even have such discussion and it be at least semi-realistic/doable. 

[Bemorewins]

Right now when the post season begins and as the Yankees continue to do what they do, I don't want to enter a post season series against them when they have two and a half aces and we have zippo. (They have Cole, at some point they will get Rodon back and they have Cortez who we have yet been able to solve.)

I know some will say "hey bring em' on and let's shock the world". But I don't think we need to embrace being under dogs and/or outgunned anymore. The path that we took to get here and the half a decade of suffering that incurred plus the brilliance of our front office in picking and developing players plus the luck that we've had has given us a very unique opportunity to do something special starting this season.

[EddeeEddee]

4 hours ago, MCO'sFan said:

Plus, Ohtani is staying out west. It will be the Dodgers or the Angels with SF as a dark horse. I can't see anyone else signing him. 

If he's really all about staying out West, I would guess Seattle probably has a shot at singing him too.