When is the best time to call up rookies?

[RarityFlaherty]

15 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think the value is often overestimated.  These are older prospects.

That very well may be the case, but there’s definitely some value there. You probably don’t realize that value until those situations arise though. I just don’t think it’s a recipe for success to send out a whole bunch of guys with little to no experience in the majors at the same time, no matter how old they are. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, RarityFlaherty said:

That very well may be the case, but there’s definitely some value there. You probably don’t realize that value until those situations arise though. I just don’t think it’s a recipe for success to send out a whole bunch of guys with little to no experience in the majors at the same time, no matter how old they are. 

But is that value worth keeping someone like Frazier or Mateo around?

I personally expect the coaches on the team to ...well..you know...coach.

[e16bball]

1 hour ago, maybenxtyr said:

Exactly... what is the difference between a struggling vet or rookie? At least they know the ceiling is pretty low for the vets I guess.

The difference is that if you stick with the struggling veteran, you get to keep both the veteran and the rookie in your organization. 

If you go with the (possibly) struggling rookie, you’ll have to jettison the struggling veteran. 

I continue to believe that Elias is still viewing things through the lens of the organization as a whole, rather than one with a primary/sole focus on the ML team. I think his goal continues to be to accumulate as much depth — as many potential assets as possible.

In other words, I think he frames the choice as (a) keep both Frazier and Westburg, with Frazier playing at the ML level or (b) only keep Westburg and play him at the ML level. Same deal with Mateo/Ortiz, Perez/Vespi, etc.

[Can_of_corn]

36 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

What Elly thread did you start?

Sorry, it's your thread.

I've just been providing most of the content. 

Honest mistake didn't mean to try and usurp any of your internet glory.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, e16bball said:

The difference is that if you stick with the struggling veteran, you get to keep both the veteran and the rookie in your organization. 

If you go with the (possibly) struggling rookie, you’ll have to jettison the struggling veteran. 

 

You are 100% correct and I question how valid a strategy that is.  At some point there will be a cost and I think it will be greater than the cost of losing a struggling vet.

[RarityFlaherty]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

But is that value worth keeping someone like Frazier or Mateo around?

I personally expect the coaches on the team to ...well..you know...coach.

Definitely. Frazier and Mateo both have a ton of value coming off the bench. Mateo would definitely be one of the best pinch runners/defensive replacements in baseball. Frazier makes for a good lefty veteran bat to come in late in games. 

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, RarityFlaherty said:

Definitely. Frazier and Mateo both have a ton of value coming off the bench. Mateo would definitely be one of the best pinch runners/defensive replacements in baseball. Frazier makes for a good lefty veteran bat to come in late in games. 

What value does Frazier have coming off the bench?  He's got an OPS+ of ...let me check...it's gone down again....84.

How is that good?  I guess if you need a lefty on the bench that might run one over the wall you can run him out there but I don't think he's a good option.  His defense and speed is poor. 

[owknows]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

What value does Frazier have coming off the bench?  He's got an OPS+ of ...let me check...it's gone down again....84.

How is that good?  I guess if you need a lefty on the bench that might run one over the wall you can run him out there but I don't think he's a good option.  His defense and speed is poor. 

Mumble mumble something..mumble clubhouse leader...

(now half the guys are smoking and doing shots between innings)

Edited June 24, 2023 by owknows

[RarityFlaherty]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

What value does Frazier have coming off the bench?  He's got an OPS+ of ...let me check...it's gone down again....84.

How is that good?  I guess if you need a lefty on the bench that might run one over the wall you can run him out there but I don't think he's a good option.  His defense and speed is poor. 

If you need a guy to just make contact to score a run, he’s one of the best guys on the team for that. He’s also had a history of big hits in situations late in game with two outs. And he’s one of the only players with any playoff experience, so he’s the best bet to give us any value from that veteran experience. 

[emmett16]

25 years old.  Can finally rent a car and will have leverage when they reach FA at 31/32.  

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, RarityFlaherty said:

If you need a guy to just make contact to score a run, he’s one of the best guys on the team for that. He’s also had a history of big hits in situations late in game with two outs. And he’s one of the only players with any playoff experience, so he’s the best bet to give us any value from that veteran experience. 

He's got an OBP of 284.  That means he makes a ton of outs.

 

[Orioles0615]

1 hour ago, Bahama O's Fan said:

Bring up Westburg and Cowser. Get McKenna and Lester off the major league roster. Bench Mateo and Frazier. Put Ortiz and Westburg at SS and 2B. Put Cowser in RF. Give Santander DH and time at 1B.

I think this still leaves you an extra player when Mountcastle comes back

[emmett16]

2 hours ago, Just Regular said:

Well, Elias.    Based on the Julio Bonus pick slot value and Steve Cohen's 5X estimate on pool dollars real world value (a candor comment I think I generally believe), Cowser or Kjerstad as an overqualified 2024 Rookie of the Year is a $10M asset.     We'll see if Gunnar can run down his opponents....I believe there is still an award if he repeats Adley 2nd place as Gunnar was on Opening Day roster, Top 100 lists, etc.

I hope Cowser and Kjerstad are here yesterday too, but I think triangulation happening even though it will cost us something in September or later this year.

 

Bingo!  This deserves its own thread.  They are building thoroughbred players to try and take advantage of the new MLB rules.  

[RarityFlaherty]

8 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He's got an OBP of 284.  That means he makes a ton of outs.

 

And? Does that change anything I just said? I’m not saying to start him. Not sure why you all have such a stick up your ass about Frazier being on the team and have to attack anyone who’s just trying to see the little bit of value that he has. 

Edited June 24, 2023 by RarityFlaherty

[7Mo]

7 minutes ago, Orioles0615 said:

I think this still leaves you an extra player when Mountcastle comes back

He's 0-11 with 5 K's. I hope it's not an automatic as to when he comes back.