Cease vs everyone else

[RZNJ]

Let me help you guys out.  Someone in Povich’s camp, agent, trainer, friend, whoever, relayed that someone in the organization (whoever) told them Povich wasn’t going anywhere this offseason and they expected him to contribute to the Orioles at some point this year.

Half of you guys are killing the messenger.  Now, some or most of us are skeptical that someone important in the organization would promise Povich he wouldn’t be traded but I don’t doubt that Husker is sincere and honest in what he has told us.   
 

Let’s say someone did tell Povich or his agent or whoever that 100% he wasn’t getting traded.  Most of us would think they were just blowing smoke.

Edited December 8, 2023 by RZNJ

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, RZNJ said:

Let me help you guys out.  Someone in Povich’s camp, agent, trainer, friend, whoever, relayed that someone in the organization (whoever) told them Povich wasn’t going anywhere this offseason and they expected him to contribute to the Orioles at some point this year.

Half of you guys are killing the messenger.  Now, some or most of us are skeptical that someone important in the organization would promise Povich he wouldn’t be traded but I don’t doubt that Husker is sincere and honest in what he has told us.   

Well, I have misunderstood him at least twice now.   Whatever.   Glad to drop the subject.  

[LookinUp]

9 minutes ago, HuskerFan said:

No, it's not my conclusion. 

Promise, last post till February.  See ya then.

#1...there's a chance you got the last word in a SG conversation. Not that he conceded his point, but still, your short time here has produced a success that most of us haven't ever achieved.

#2...I don't care about your definitions or anyone else's, I just hope that you're credible and I can read between the lines and think that the O's REALLY like Povich. The alternative is that they're over valuing him because they have a dearth of other pitching talent and/or resources to obtain additional talent. I don't like that alternative.

[Sports Guy]

19 minutes ago, 24fps said:

Let's see, your info comes from the "Povich camp" which could be "a number of different people"... Nope, nothing cryptic about that at all.  Look, credibility is immediately going to be an issue for anyone posting insider information and no amount of name-calling is going to have any impact.  If anything, just the opposite.

Correct.

I don’t doubt that he is hearing things.

But calling him untouchable, which is what he is saying/doing, is going too far. No chance the org views him as untouchable. 
 

I don’t doubt, given the lack of pitching prospects, that the Os would rather trade positional guys before him, maybe even positional guys ranked ahead of him.

Thats different than saying they wouldn’t trade him. They absolutely would. 

They probably won’t, just as they probably won’t trade basically every player in the organization. That’s not exactly going out on a limb or anything. 
 

[24fps]

30 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Correct.

I don’t doubt that he is hearing things.

But calling him untouchable, which is what he is saying/doing, is going too far. No chance the org views him as untouchable. 
 

I don’t doubt, given the lack of pitching prospects, that the Os would rather trade positional guys before him, maybe even positional guys ranked ahead of him.

Thats different than saying they wouldn’t trade him. They absolutely would. 

They probably won’t, just as they probably won’t trade basically every player in the organization. That’s not exactly going out on a limb or anything. 
 

In their last Orioles Top 10, BA doesn't mention Povich at all and Tony-OH has him at 13.  If he had suddenly skyrocketed up the organizational ranks to the point that he was considered too valuable to trade, you would think we we'd have heard something from a mainstream source by now, right? 

As for HuskerFan's credibility in general, I simply don't believe in vaguely sourced, quasi-inside information that has popped up out of nowhere on a message board.

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, 24fps said:

In their last Orioles Top 10, BA doesn't mention Povich at all and Tony-OH has him at 13.  If he had suddenly skyrocketed up the organizational ranks to the point that he was considered too valuable to trade, you would think we we'd have heard something from a mainstream source by now, right? 

As for HuskerFan's credibility in general, I simply don't believe in vaguely sourced, quasi-inside information that has popped up out of nowhere on a message board.

I don’t have an issue with you saying that although I’m sure some will.

I believe the guy has heard things because it would just be an odd thing to lie about and I would guess he’s not lying about being a Nebraska fan, so it’s not surprising to me that he could hear things.

I have no doubt the team likes him and I don’t doubt that they would rather keep him vs trade him..after all, he was the key to the Lopez deal and Elias talked glowingly about him at the time.

But this is also a guy who has struggled to ever put back to back good starts together and has control and command issues. No matter what you think he has a chance to be, you don’t make that player off limits in trade talks when you are trying to get over the hump and win a title. The top 3 guys? Absolutely.  Saying Povich is thought of the same way, in terms of trade or not, as Holliday is where he loses me. It’s just not true.

Edited December 8, 2023 by Sports Guy

[btdart20]

22 hours ago, HuskerFan said:

Sounds like everyone on here can remove Povich from their trade options this winter.  Solid reports coming out of their camp, O's are very high on him & expect him to be a contributor in 2024. 

The 'Norby camp' said he got the vibes that he expected to be traded last off-season.  Then he went out and posted a great 2023 line.  All this to say, players and management are two very different things.

I hope we keep Povich around.  He has as much upside as anyone in the org.  When he's on, he's a plus SP.  

[btdart20]

38 minutes ago, 24fps said:

As for HuskerFan's credibility in general, I simply don't believe in vaguely sourced, quasi-inside information that has popped up out of nowhere on a message board.

I think he has more credibility regarding Povich than anyone else on this board.  Not saying he 'knows all' but I'd believe what he says on this type of thing more than anyone else on this board.

[Sports Guy]

4 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

I think he has more credibility regarding Povich than anyone else on this board.  Not saying he 'knows all' but I'd believe what he says on this type of thing more than anyone else on this board.

That’s not really saying much though. 

[btdart20]

52 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t have an issue with you saying that although I’m sure some will.

I believe the guy has heard things because it would just be an odd thing to lie about and I would guess he’s not lying about being a Nebraska fan, so it’s not surprising to me that he could hear things.

I have no doubt the team likes him and I don’t doubt that they would rather keep him vs trade him..after all, he was the key to the Lopez deal and Elias talked glowingly about him at the time.

But this is also a guy who has struggled to ever put back to back good starts together and has control and command issues. No matter what you think he has a chance to be, you don’t make that player off limits in trade talks when you are trying to get over the hump and win a title. The top 3 guys? Absolutely.  Saying Povich is thought of the same way, in terms of trade or not, as Holliday is where he loses me. It’s just not true.

And no different than this.  

[Frobby]

4 hours ago, 24fps said:

In their last Orioles Top 10, BA doesn't mention Povich at all and Tony-OH has him at 13.  If he had suddenly skyrocketed up the organizational ranks to the point that he was considered too valuable to trade, you would think we we'd have heard something from a mainstream source by now, right? 

As for HuskerFan's credibility in general, I simply don't believe in vaguely sourced, quasi-inside information that has popped up out of nowhere on a message board.

People have their different views, and that’s fine.  Kiley McDaniel had Povich in his preseason top 100, and Fangraphs presently lists Povich as our no. 5 prospect, ahead of Cowser, Ortiz, Norby etc.  https://www.fangraphs.com/prospects/the-board?org=bal

I personally feel Tony has it about right, but our shortage of top pitching prospects, especially at the higher levels, makes Povich less appealing to trade than several of our position prospects who are somewhat redundant of other players in our system.   

[interloper]

After the trifecta of Ohtani to the Jays, and the back to back fakeouts with the lease and team sale, it would be great for Mike to throw us a bone sometime soon. 

Rough day.

[orioles119]

I have the same collective response to the Ohtani news as a I do the Soto news...

MEH

[24fps]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

People have their different views, and that’s fine.  Kiley McDaniel had Povich in his preseason top 100, and Fangraphs presently lists Povich as our no. 5 prospect, ahead of Cowser, Ortiz, Norby etc.  https://www.fangraphs.com/prospects/the-board?org=bal

I personally feel Tony has it about right, but our shortage of top pitching prospects, especially at the higher levels, makes Povich less appealing to trade than several of our position prospects who are somewhat redundant of other players in our system.   

I'm a big fan of different views, especially if they're not presented in an exceedingly patronizing tone as was the case with HuskerFan's contribution to the thread.

I agree with your feeling that Tony has it about right and and the O's shortage of top pitching prospects make the few they have a little more valuable as a result, but using him in a trade for a demonstrably better starter (for example) is perfectly reasonable if it has to be.  I'd rather he stay in the organization.

I don't know what to make of Povich's Fangraphs ranking. 

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, 24fps said:

I'm a big fan of different views, especially if they're not presented in an exceedingly patronizing tone as was the case with HuskerFan's contribution to the thread.

I agree with your feeling that Tony has it about right and and the O's shortage of top pitching prospects make the few they have a little more valuable as a result, but using him in a trade for a demonstrably better starter (for example) is perfectly reasonable if it has to be.  I'd rather he stay in the organization.

I don't know what to make of Povich's Fangraphs ranking. 

We’ll see if he stays there when Longenhagen does his Orioles writeup next spring.