Roberts Must Go

[Stotle]

I think Lillibridge could be had for Sherrill/Walker/Bradford & a minor league pitcher from our pile.

Dont know about Nelson... I would try to pry Bignac....

If the O's could squeeze Chen out of the Bedard deal & Play Cedeno at SS this year. He actually has enough ceiling to improve. And he will hit more than 3 EBH's this year.

Brignac isn't going anywhere -- he's by far better than any other option they have at SS. TAM is (correctly) taking their time and letting him progress a level at a time with the goal of having him in place for a run in 2010.

I think Lillibridge could be had during the season for a package along those lines provided Escobar gets off to a great start. If he struggles, ATL will not move Brent.

Chen -- I don't think he's coming.

Cedeno -- fine as an option if it doesn't cost Roberts to get him.

[HarryReasonable]

So what about a deal involving some combination of Roberts, Scott, and Reimond for some combination of Pie, Gallagher, E. Patterson, Cedeno, and Marshall/Marquis?

C Hernandez (keeping it warm for Weiters)

1B Millar/Huff (keeping it warm for Brandon Snyder or Tex)

2B E. Patterson (could turn out to be fairly decent)

SS R. Cedeno (we'd need to upgrade eventually or move Jones here)

3B Mora/Moore (keeping it warm for Rowell)

LF Pie

CF Ad. Jones

RF Markakis

SP Guthrie, Loewen, Cabrera, Gallagher/Marshall/Marquis, Patton/Albers/Olson/Penn/Liz

RP The usual suspects

CL Sherrill

So what do you think - would throwing in Reimond, Scott, or both in with Roberts make the Cubs more willing to part with Pie? Would we even want to do that? I'm curious what people's thoughts are. Are they any good scenarios involving this group of players that would make sense for both sides?

So, excluding the pitchers you mentioned, you're trading away an above average 2nd baseman, a pretty solid left-filelder and one of our rising stars for a second baseman who "could turn out to be fairly decent" (whatever that means), a shortstop who "will need to be upgraded eventually" and a center fielder who may never really be a good hitter. I have to pass on this one. And for the record, there'a reason that Adam Jones is no longer playing shortstop - we need to let this idea go.

[davearm]

Post 160. No facts distorted. I've pointed out I think the Cubs have valuable pieces to move. I've said I don't think BAL is a good fit. Comments like the bolded above truly make you look ridiculous...

I think you need to go re-read post #160 more carefully. Apparently it is the source of your continued confusion.

Nowhere here have I said I like the trade, as you claim.

[davearm]

So, excluding the pitchers you mentioned, you're trading away an above average 2nd baseman, a pretty solid left-filelder and one of our rising stars for a second baseman who "could turn out to be fairly decent" (whatever that means), a shortstop who "will need to be upgraded eventually" and a center fielder who may never really be a good hitter. I have to pass on this one. And for the record, there'a reason that Adam Jones is no longer playing shortstop - we need to let this idea go.

Reimold = "rising star"

Pie = "may never really be a good hitter"

Oh brother...

[amateurfan]

The discussion continues because lots of knowledgeable O's fans think this is something the O's should take.

And I happen to agree with them that whatever is being offered now, is much more likely to go down than up 6 months or a year from now.

In the context of the discussion that took place, it more than suggests that you endorse the trade (or for that matter any other trade the Orioles would make simply because Robert's value is higher now than six months from now). Language does not have meaning in a vacuum. Be more careful writing before becoming overbearing and righteous. It's not flattering.

[hefalumps]

So, excluding the pitchers you mentioned, you're trading away an above average 2nd baseman, a pretty solid left-filelder and one of our rising stars for a second baseman who "could turn out to be fairly decent" (whatever that means), a shortstop who "will need to be upgraded eventually" and a center fielder who may never really be a good hitter. I have to pass on this one. And for the record, there'a reason that Adam Jones is no longer playing shortstop - we need to let this idea go.

I didn't say I wanted to trade Roberts, Scott, and Reimold straight up for Patterson, Cedeno, and Pie. I said some combination of the mentioned players.

Like I said, I don't think Pie is worth it personally, but some folks do. So if Pie is really worth it, what else would it take to get him and would it make sense?

I agree with Stottle's comments - unless the Cubs are planning on trying Soriano back in CF again, which I doubt, they do need a CF. And I'm sure the O's agree that they'd much rather have Jones in CF than Pie. So in that case, I don't understand why we'd even be entertaining trading Roberts for Pie.

[Roll Tide]

Brignac isn't going anywhere -- he's by far better than any other option they have at SS. TAM is (correctly) taking their time and letting him progress a level at a time with the goal of having him in place for a run in 2010.

I think Lillibridge could be had during the season for a package along those lines provided Escobar gets off to a great start. If he struggles, ATL will not move Brent.

Chen -- I don't think he's coming.

Cedeno -- fine as an option if it doesn't cost Roberts to get him.

Chen could be had for a prospect or PTBNL.

[Rex Thunder]

Is there a starving need for attention here? Why the need for yet ANOTHER thread on the same topic that has been discussed and beaten to death for the past month???

[HarryReasonable]

Reimold = "rising star"

Pie = "may never really be a good hitter"

Oh brother...

LOL - I guess you could use those 2 descriptions interchangeably, couldn't you? We still don't know how either guy will perform at the big league level from an offensive standpoint, and I will admit that Pie has a huge edge defensively. Sorry if I hit a nerve there....

[bigbird]

You don;t trade Roberts just to "fill a hole". Now if you can fill the hole with quality then you make the trade. I'd much rather have Roberts, Hernandez and 2 top 40 draft picks after next year than Gallagher, Murton and Cedeno.

[davearm]

In the context of the discussion that took place, it more than suggests that you endorse the trade (or for that matter any other trade the Orioles would make simply because Robert's value is higher now than six months from now). Language does not have meaning in a vacuum. Be more careful writing before becoming overbearing and righteous. It's not flattering.

It suggests I endorse the trade from the O's perspective. It does not suggest I like the trade from the Cubs' perspective, as has been incorrectly inferred.

In fact I've been hoping this trade does not happen for awhile now, and I've posted that opinion several times recently. Do some searching if you need convincing.

[Pruke]

It suggests no such thing.

In fact I've been hoping this trade does not happen for awhile now, and I've posted that opinion several times recently. Do some searching if you need convincing.

Oddly enough, given the majority of fans don't want this trade to happen, I'm inclined to think it WILL happen and will happen in short order. No source, no proof, just the law of the O's.

[davearm]

You don;t trade Roberts just to "fill a hole". Now if you can fill the hole with quality then you make the trade. I'd much rather have Roberts, Hernandez and 2 top 40 draft picks after next year than Gallagher, Murton and Cedeno.

The draft picks are a definite maybe.

[Camden_yardbird]

If the Cubs are the only suitor now then doesn't it make more sense to wait and trade Roberts at the trade deadline? You will have more teams interested. Pie and Murton will still not be integral parts of the cubs team, so they will still be available. Plus you get to see what Pie can do in half a season. Roberts trade value will not have dropped that much, and may even rise.

[hefalumps]

Is there a starving need for attention here? Why the need for yet ANOTHER thread on the same topic that has been discussed and beaten to death for the past month???

You know - anytime lately that I try to create a new discussion about something that may have been mentioned in other threads, I get blasted for creating "yet another thread." I was not looking for attention - I was just trying to single out a specific idea, elaborate on it, and encourage discussion. I thought that's what message boards were for. But I guess my threads haven't been original enough - something to work on.

I just wanted to figure out why the O's wanted to trade Roberts for Pie, creating holes at 2B and SS to get another young prospect OF - it didn't make sense to me. So I figured if they seem high on Pie (heh), maybe there's some way to put in more players and have it make more sense than Roberts for Pie straight up.

So sorry if I created yet another redundant post. Stuff like this is why a lot of relative newcomers are afraid to ever post anything - because it might be a rehash of other comments buried in some other 15-20 page threads that got overlooked by the poster, and then they get yelled at. Anyway, my apologies. From now on I'll just add to other discussions and save thread creation for the veterans.

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