The Shift...

[big_sparxx]

I heard some talk last season that MLB was going to address the "shift" defense (although I don't know how they would). What did it take Pedro Alvarez... like 25 games or something to get a hit last year? Is the shift here to stay? 

[Redskins Rick]

29 minutes ago, big_sparxx said:

I heard some talk last season that MLB was going to address the "shift" defense (although I don't know how they would). What did it take Pedro Alvarez... like 25 games or something to get a hit last year? Is the shift here to stay? 

IMO, I don't see the shift going anywhere. No way MLB can start dictating play on the field.

If you want to put 6 guys in the OF, then so be it, or you want 6 guys in the infield, so be it, live with the consequences.

 

[Whammer]

Yeah - guys like Davis, Alvarez, Trumbo, etc. should spend the offseason learning to adjust their swing to the defense.  Learn how to bunt even.

[weams]

54 minutes ago, big_sparxx said:

I heard some talk last season that MLB was going to address the "shift" defense (although I don't know how they would). What did it take Pedro Alvarez... like 25 games or something to get a hit last year? Is the shift here to stay? 

Yeah. It was Manfred. And they did not. For five years. 

[weams]

24 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

IMO, I don't see the shift going anywhere. No way MLB can start dictating play on the field.

If you want to put 6 guys in the OF, then so be it, or you want 6 guys in the infield, so be it, live with the consequences.

 

CBA says you are right. 

[Camden_yardbird]

I believe they could change this at the owners meetings.  It is not required to be in the CBA.  I just think the owners meeting this year were consumed by the CBA.  I'm guessing we see a change next year.

[MDtransplant757]

3 minutes ago, Camden_yardbird said:

I believe they could change this at the owners meetings.  It is not required to be in the CBA.  I just think the owners meeting this year were consumed by the CBA.  I'm guessing we see a change next year.

I'd honestly think at the owner's meetings this year that the DH will be added to the NL

[SteveA]

6 minutes ago, MDtransplant757 said:

I'd honestly think at the owner's meetings this year that the DH will be added to the NL

I think that is something the players would want a say in as it speaks to the composition of the roster, so I don't think the owners can do it unilaterally.   Would probably have to be in the CBA.   Now maybe they discussed it during CBA negotiations and could be close to something agreeable, I don't know.   But I don't think the owners make this change without the players' involvement.

[MDtransplant757]

Just now, SteveA said:

I think that is something the players would want a say in as it speaks to the composition of the roster, so I don't think the owners can do it unilaterally.   Would probably have to be in the CBA.   Now maybe they discussed it during CBA negotiations and could be close to something agreeable, I don't know.   But I don't think the owners make this change without the players' involvement.

Makes enough sense, but that's how the DH got into the AL and how it was rejected into the NL

[OFFNY]

4 hours ago, Redskins Rick said:

IMO, I don't see the shift going anywhere. No way MLB can start dictating play on the field.

If you want to put 6 guys in the OF, then so be it, or you want 6 guys in the infield, so be it, live with the consequences.

 

o

 

Agreed, as any tampering with the current rules would open up a whole can of worms that would likely lead to disaster. 

Other than the pitcher and the catcher, the remaining 7 players can play anywhere on the field they want (in fair territory) when the pitcher releases the ball.

I hate it when an Orioles player hits a line drive up the middle for what seems to be a single, but it goes right into a shifted player's glove ...... but there is no way in hell that I would want them dictating where the remaining 7 position players (other than the pitcher and the catcher) can play on the field.

[Chavez Ravine]

6 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Agreed, as any tampering with the current rules would open up a whole can of worms that would likely lead to disaster. 

Other than the pitcher and the catcher, the remaining 7 players can play anywhere on the field they want (in fair territory) when the pitcher releases the ball.

I hate it when an Orioles player hits a line drive up the middle for what seems to be a single, but it goes right into a shifted player's glove ...... but there is no way in hell that I would want them dictating where the remaining 7 position players (other than the pitcher and the catcher) can play on the field.

I agree. The previous positioning of players was not dictated by edict, it was the conventional wisdom about where a second baseman or shortstop should play in order to maximize the outs they made.  Nothing has changed about the game except that we now have a bit better information on which to base our conventional wisdom.

A great game is not defined by the rules.  The rules set the stage for performances.

[UpstateNYfan]

Until offenses use the weakness of the defense it will continue. It is the only game to my knowledge that does that. Drives me nuts when the O's are down by two or three runs and need baserunners guys like Davis don't even try to go to the off field. It's like a huge water hazard in golf right in your landing zone and continually not changing your approach. Sometimes you have to take what the D gives you.

[Larry18]

7 hours ago, Chavez Ravine said:

I agree. The previous positioning of players was not dictated by edict, it was the conventional wisdom about where a second baseman or shortstop should play in order to maximize the outs they made.  Nothing has changed about the game except that we now have a bit better information on which to base our conventional wisdom.

A great game is not defined by the rules.  The rules set the stage for performances.

This is an excellent point.

[Number5]

11 hours ago, Chavez Ravine said:

I agree. The previous positioning of players was not dictated by edict, it was the conventional wisdom about where a second baseman or shortstop should play in order to maximize the outs they made.  Nothing has changed about the game except that we now have a bit better information on which to base our conventional wisdom.

A great game is not defined by the rules.  The rules set the stage for performances.

Yes.

In fact, there really isn't anything new about shifting, either.  It's been done my whole life.  MLB teams are employing more severe shifts vs. some players than they generally have in the past based on the greater swing chart information available to them now, but they've employed shifts for a long time.  There have been exceptions - Lou Boudreau's shift vs. Ted Williams was as drastic as any you see today.  Teams shifted vs. guys like Boog Powell and Roger Maris - just not anything like what we see vs. Davis.

Heck, teams I've played on from the playground and Little League right up thru senior softball now shift vs. nearly every batter.  You get to know guys' tendencies and you play defense accordingly.

In any case, I agree, there is simply no need to address this with a bogus rule.  There already is a rule dealing with defensive alignment - the pitcher must toe the rubber, the catcher must be in the catchers box, and the other seven players must be in fair territory.  That rule covers it and doesn't need to be changed.