Rosenthal: Orioles Uequivocally Plan to be Buyers

[weams]

12 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Yankees' payroll has gone down and their record never went under .500.

So which happened to them?

They bought big pitching with their flexibility. And then when they tanked, they traded it. And now they are losers. Just like us. No pitching. 

[SteveA]

1 minute ago, spiritof66 said:

And even then, it doesn't always work. You need a combination of luck and skill to build a winning team with young, unproven players.

I would say there is a similar combination of luck and skill needed to build a winning team with older, veteran players.

 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, weams said:

They bought big pitching with their flexibility. And then when they tanked, they traded it. And now they are losers. Just like us. No pitching. 

As they rebuilt their payroll went down.

Unlike us they have won more games than they have lost.  They are also currently in first place.

[weams]

7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

As they rebuilt their payroll went down.

Unlike us they have won more games than they have lost.  They are also currently in first place.

Only because they had Arod. It has been a while since they were very good. But sure. Maybe they will hold on to their placement. 

[vab]

Who cares if the Orioles plan to be buyers? They have nothing to sell. Now if this season ends up the way it looks like it will and they're still holding on and trying to patch things up, then it's time to get mad. Duquette should not be trusted with a rebuild anyway and hiring a new GM now and holding a fire sale within a month is not realistic. 

[spiritof66]

Just now, SteveA said:

I would say there is a similar combination of luck and skill needed to build a winning team with older, veteran players.

I think there's a difference. If I have a .500 team, and I figure I am four more good players away from having a contender, I may be able to trade for (or sign as free agents) some or all of those four -- if I have the money. Sure, the outcome will be affected by how wisely I choose those guys, and how lucky I am in my players not being injured and performing up to expectations. But I'm likely -- not certain, but likely -- to have a team that finishes .500 or better.

I think that's different from what I face if I clean house and build a team by bringing in young players. If I am trying to use those trades (and the draft) to build a new starting rotation, I might end up with the equivalent of Maddux, Smoltz and Glavine and a immediately a pretty good team, or I might end up with a version of the Oriole Cavalry and a really bad team.

 

 

[Enjoy Terror]

18 minutes ago, weams said:

They bought big pitching with their flexibility. And then when they tanked, they traded it. And now they are losers. Just like us. No pitching. 

I misread this comment because I'm dumb. Have an upvote

[hoosiers]

2 minutes ago, SteveA said:

I would say there is a similar combination of luck and skill needed to build a winning team with older, veteran players.

 

Probably need more because there would likely be a higher payroll (less payroll flexibility) with the vets.

This team is nowhere near competitive.  It got out of the gates quick and has been terrible since.  We don't have the best prospects to trade and we don't have the upper level prospects to call up compared to most teams.

What we do have is Dan Duquette's "we're more committed", "all in", "going to go through every asset or die trying" attitude which will continue to trade off future draft picks, international slots, prospects and young players until there is nothing left but our next playoff team at least four long losing years in the future.  Thanks in advance Dan.

[Tx Oriole]

8 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

But, if a team wants to make a solid offer for a piece that isn't Britton I don't see why the O's shouldn't listen and if the deal is there, take it.  Does even the most optimistic fan think this team can win multiple playoff series?

I am with you on this one Can. And no I don't see them winning a playoff series. 

[SteveA]

8 minutes ago, spiritof66 said:

I think there's a difference. If I have a .500 team, and I figure I am four more good players away from having a contender, I may be able to trade for (or sign as free agents) some or all of those four -- if I have the money. Sure, the outcome will be affected by how wisely I choose those guys, and how lucky I am in my players not being injured and performing up to expectations. But I'm likely -- not certain, but likely -- to have a team that finishes .500 or better.

I think that's different from what I face if I clean house and build a team by bringing in young players. If I am trying to use those trades (and the draft) to build a new starting rotation, I might end up with the equivalent of Maddux, Smoltz and Glavine and a immediately a pretty good team, or I might end up with a version of the Oriole Cavalry and a really bad team.

 

 

You don't need to hit on all your young players if you have enough.

If you don't have a big payroll, you pretty much have to hit on all of your big money free agents or you are in big trouble.   Sort of like we are (and we have an above average payroll).

[Moose Milligan]

[spiritof66]

22 minutes ago, Enjoy Terror said:

Sorry, that's just not true. Aroldis Chapman may have gotten them Gleyber Torres, but their farm system strength is predominantly drafted and international players.

The NYYs have drafted and developed players much more successfully than the Orioles in recent years. Then again, who hasn't?

They also have spent a ton more money on payroll, posting fees, and building a Latin America infrastructure than the Orioles. All of which makes sense since their revenues dwarf the Orioles'. The NYYs acquired, among other pieces, Sanchez, Severino, our own Montero (who brought Pineda), and I'm sure others through the international draft. 

 

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, spiritof66 said:

The NYYs have drafted and developed players much more successfully than the Orioles in recent years. Then again, who hasn't?

They also have spent a ton more money on payroll, posting fees, and building a Latin America infrastructure than the Orioles. All of which makes sense since their revenues dwarf the Orioles'. The NYYs acquired, among other pieces, Sanchez, Severino, our own Montero (who brought Pineda), and I'm sure others through the international draft. 

 

Everything they did (unlike the Red Sox) was fully within the rules.  Plenty of teams whose revenues do not dwarf the O's outspend them in the international market.  It is more about the O's than it is the Yankees.

[Cumberbundy]

That's the worst news possible. If we can turn it around, ride whatever was believed in going into the year. We can't continue to trade away pieces of the future. I assume no one wanted Mancini and that's why we still have him, there's nearly no chance he was in DDs plans.

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Yankees' payroll has gone down and their record never went under .500.

So which happened to them?

For one thing, they were outscored in 2013, 2014 and 2016, yet managed to have a winning record each year.    Mostly because they always had a great bullpen.    

For another thing, their "lower payrolls" were still at the very top end of the league.  Ironically, this year is the lowest their payroll has been since 2003.