Kjerstad comes in at #99 on BA Top 100

[Orioles1954]

3 hours ago, AnythingO's said:

I won't get into the middle of the pi$$ing contest but Kjerstad hustled back to the bag and the 1B was shifting toward the bag after receiving the throw and IMO 1B was over the bag as Kjerstad got there. They collide, 1B looses his balance and falls backward. There was solid body contact IMO though. Kjerstad could have grabbed him, maybe.  I don't see a cheap shot and I'm FAR from a Homer. If anyone is "insinuating" it's you. You view Martin as BPA, I thought Lacy. I agree with SG, Martin isn't that highly rated unless he stays on left side of IF or CF. I think his comp is becoming Roberts and I would go back to WC pre-draft posts against using #2 for a 2B. Manny did far worse than that.

It's a GOOD thing the SEC Network didn't show that game when Kjerstad tore the wings off of a butterfly, pushed a little old lady and spat on the ump! That Heston is a BAD dude. Martin on the other hand....Nobel Prize.

Edited July 1, 2020 by Orioles1954

[makoman]

9 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

See ...this is just another example of a poor post! Show me where anybody predicted Kjerstad would have a -205 batting average. Is it poor comprehension, are just stupid, or are you hoping to get some free rep for saying something truly ridiculous like it was a fact.

Heres a fact for you absurd post, If Kjerstad hits .205 or anywhere close to it after year 2 in the majors he won’t be around very long. Also the only reason Chris Davis and his 27 million dollar contract didn’t make that list is he was essentially a part time player 139Ks in 352 ABs. 
 

Why would you only use players that make your argument ....As been said by someone else, Whitaker, Pedroia, Molitor (22 HRs was his highest), Wade Boggs (22 was highest and his second highest was 11). See, I can do it too!

The guy is widely considered to have the best bat in the draft. I have no idea what he will be anymore or less than you do! Same with Kjerstad! But, I still think he’s the better prospect and don’t think is by a narrow margin. That is my opinion....If I end up being wrong at very least I will be man enough to admit it! I’m betting most of the guys on the other side of it won’t.....wait and see! 
 

 

You clearly didn't read or understand my point. Let me spell it out.

You said you didn't want the guy who strikes out a ton, even if he's successful. So I looked at the guys who struck out a ton and were successful (because they got to play enough to strike out a lot) last year to see what they were worth last year. I brought up Odor and his .205 as he was the outlier who wasn't worth much. I never said you said anything about .205 (but you did say .240, which also has no basis in anything).

And I looked at the guys last year who fit your desired profile (lots of doubles, 15ish HR, good average) last year to see what they were worth.

The point was the high K high power guys compared favorably to the high doubles high average lower power guys. 

Note: I don't care what hall of famers from a bygone era were worth. It's a bit more relevant to today's game to look at guys from last year, not Wade Boggs. Mike Schmidt led the league in Ks several times, I didn't bring him up.

What a whiny post. It's really getting old, talking about yourself as "a man" and everybody else as kool aid drinkers. To be honest I was pretty ambivalent about this pick from the start but your posts have really convinced me to like the pick more and more just by being so grating. 

[Roll Tide]

40 minutes ago, makoman said:

You clearly didn't read or understand my point. Let me spell it out.

You said you didn't want the guy who strikes out a ton, even if he's successful. So I looked at the guys who struck out a ton and were successful (because they got to play enough to strike out a lot) last year to see what they were worth last year. I brought up Odor and his .205 as he was the outlier who wasn't worth much. I never said you said anything about .205 (but you did say .240, which also has no basis in anything).

And I looked at the guys last year who fit your desired profile (lots of doubles, 15ish HR, good average) last year to see what they were worth.

The point was the high K high power guys compared favorably to the high doubles high average lower power guys. 

Note: I don't care what hall of famers from a bygone era were worth. It's a bit more relevant to today's game to look at guys from last year, not Wade Boggs. Mike Schmidt led the league in Ks several times, I didn't bring him up.

What a whiny post. It's really getting old, talking about yourself as "a man" and everybody else as kool aid drinkers. To be honest I was pretty ambivalent about this pick from the start but your posts have really convinced me to like the pick more and more just by being so grating. 

You can always block me 

[CarrRun49]

1 hour ago, Roll Tide said:

You can always block me 

Pretty sure @atomic blocked me after I didn't agree that the NWSL should take over the Orioles spot at Camden Yards

[CarrRun49]

14 hours ago, AnythingO's said:

I won't get into the middle of the pi$$ing contest but Kjerstad hustled back to the bag and the 1B was shifting toward the bag after receiving the throw and IMO 1B was over the bag as Kjerstad got there. They collide, 1B looses his balance and falls backward. There was solid body contact IMO though. Kjerstad could have grabbed him, maybe.  I don't see a cheap shot and I'm FAR from a Homer. If anyone is "insinuating" it's you. You view Martin as BPA, I thought Lacy. I agree with SG, Martin isn't that highly rated unless he stays on left side of IF or CF. I think his comp is becoming Roberts and I would go back to WC pre-draft posts against using #2 for a 2B. Manny did far worse than that.

Agreed. Non-issue.  Throughout my baseball career, I can say this type of play occurs fairly routinely (far less as you get to advanced leagues). Errant throws that take the 1B up the line that end up in a slight shove from the runner. Meh.

[waroriole]

12 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

 

So he took 2.5 million less .... I rest my case! If the Orioles or Kjerstad thought there was a narrow margin between him and Martin, Lacy etc .....He doesn’t accept 2.5 million light.

Can you please rest your case? Please. 

[AnythingO's]

12 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

I wasn’t the only one .... @Can_of_corn was the guy saying it was a D*** move. I gave my opinion. I get it, it’s a fan site and there will be homerism. At least have the intestinal fortitude to admit it.

Wait, I'm just seeing this response. So you are accusing me on not having "the intestinal fortitude to admit" I'm a homer?????  Really???? I didn't like Martin before the draft and wanted Lacy. I want no part of Boras and any player that picks him, I believe he is bad for the game. I agree with SG that Martin's value pre-draft was tied to staying on the left side or CF. I don't believe he will because of arm. So WC's argument again pre-draft, that we shouldn't spend 1-2 on a good 2B is valid to me. But in your world that means I lack intestinal fortitude and am a homer, for the egregious offense of not agreeing with you. Wow

[Roll Tide]

39 minutes ago, CarrRun49 said:

Pretty sure @atomic blocked me after I didn't agree that the NWSL should take over the Orioles spot at Camden Yards

Yeah, I don't mind discussing things and I know my opinions aren't popular. But, They are indeed mine and unlikely to change until I am proven wrong. As I mentioned, at least they are mine and the guys who have been around know that I am not a troll or just trying to be difficult. I truly believe in what I am saying.  If they don't agree thats fine and I think we should be able to have the conversation without the bad wagon team up approach, throwing around bad rep, and other BS.

I am really getting to the point where the board is not fun anymore and perhaps I will step away myself. Its better than reading the insults and constant hacking that I get for nothing more than having an opinion thats different.

[Roll Tide]

13 minutes ago, AnythingO's said:

Wait, I'm just seeing this response. So you are accusing me on not having "the intestinal fortitude to admit" I'm a homer?????  Really???? I didn't like Martin before the draft and wanted Lacy. I want no part of Boras and any player that picks him, I believe he is bad for the game. I agree with SG that Martin's value pre-draft was tied to staying on the left side or CF. I don't believe he will because of arm. So WC's argument again pre-draft, that we shouldn't spend 1-2 on a good 2B is valid to me. But in your world that means I lack intestinal fortitude and am a homer, for the egregious offense of not agreeing with you. Wow

Really?

We were discussing Kjerstad knocking down the 1B on his return to the bag. How did that turn into a discussion about your feelings pf Martin?

Homerism can be many things, in this case some here are giving Kjerstad the benefit of the doubt on that play. COC had sounded off about his negative feeling about the play a page or two before I commented. When I played baseball and needed to return to a bag that drew a throw I was taught to dive/slide back into the bag to avoid contact, tackling the defender, or having a collision.

We can agree to disagree, its a fine, But I'm sure the mass would have a different opinion of the play if the player belonging to the Orange and Black would have been the defender, and even harsher if that player had been injured.

 

[Sports Guy]

4 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Yeah, I don't mind discussing things and I know my opinions aren't popular. But, They are indeed mine and unlikely to change until I am proven wrong. As I mentioned, at least they are mine and the guys who have been around know that I am not a troll or just trying to be difficult. I truly believe in what I am saying.  If they don't agree thats fine and I think we should be able to have the conversation without the bad wagon team up approach, throwing around bad rep, and other BS.

I am really getting to the point where the board is not fun anymore and perhaps I will step away myself. Its better than reading the insults and constant hacking that I get for nothing more than having an opinion thats different.

You know it’s not your opinion itself but how you are presenting that opinion, right?

Its fair to be worried that Kjerstad will not walk enough or that his defensive value will be limited.  It’s also fair to say, will he hit for a high enough average and show enough power to justify the Ks?

That being said, if he can hit 250-270 (and his hit tool is very good) and he hits 35+ homers, you are likely looking at someone who will walk enough..he will never walk a lot but you could see a Mancini like jump from last year, where Trey got his walk rate up to 8.8%.  That should get Kjerstad in the 330-350 OBP range.  If he can do and his power plays, you are looking at an 850-900 OPS OFer with a cannon arm and game changing power.  If he does that while striking out 200 times, who cares?

[DrungoHazewood]

Maybe this thread would have been more productive if it went more like this:

Kjerstad is #99 on the BA list.

Yep, Martin is higher, wish they'd taken him instead.

Well, the strategy was to take the cheaper player so the overall draft class might be stronger.

Sure, but I'm not convinced it'll work out.

Yea, nobody really is.

Wanna get a beer? 

Sure.

[Roll Tide]

44 minutes ago, waroriole said:

Can you please rest your case? Please. 

I DId!

Anyway, Why do you care?

[Roll Tide]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

1)You know it’s not your opinion itself but how you are presenting that opinion, right?

2) Its fair to be worried that Kjerstad will not walk enough or that his defensive value will be limited.  It’s also fair to say, will he hit for a high enough average and show enough power to justify the Ks?

That being said, if he can hit 250-270 (and his hit tool is very good) and he hits 35+ homers, you are likely looking at someone who will walk enough..he will never walk a lot but you could see a Mancini like jump from last year, where Trey got his walk rate up to 8.8%.  That should get Kjerstad in the 330-350 OBP range.  If he can do and his power plays, you are looking at an 850-900 OPS OFer with a cannon arm and game changing power.   3) If he does that while striking out 200 times, who cares?

How so?

Rob, It wouldn't matter!

2) Its fair to say whatever you want about what you think he will or wont be. I should have the same right. Some guys don't want to say or here anything negative about the Orioles, Elias, Angelos, the draft process, Poor trade return, penny pinching, and just bad decisions.

• I hated the return for Cashner, the same type issue happened as in this thread
• I hated that we gave Villar away for little (I don't want to debate it here again)
• I wasn't impressed with last years draft (Anyone could have made the AR pick)
• I'm not happy with this draft! (I've rested my case)

Anyone of these subjects have resulted in heated debates!

If he hits .270 w/ 35 Homers and 85+ RBIs he ends up being a very good pick and you could probably be happy even if Martin ends up being Pedroia or something close.

3) It wouldn't matter except the Orioles as recently as a few years ago had a ton of those guys. It resulted in a lot pf games where we couldn't score due to too many guys having high K rates. Thats why I have been an advocate for high AVG/OBP guys.

 

[Roll Tide]

45 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Maybe this thread would have been more productive if it went more like this:

Kjerstad is #99 on the BA list.

Yep, Martin is higher, wish they'd taken him instead.

Well, the strategy was to take the cheaper player so the overall draft class might be stronger.

Sure, but I'm not convinced it'll work out.

Yea, nobody really is.

Wanna get a beer? 

Sure.

The only problem is there are to many guys here that you have to agree with or else!

[Roll Tide]

13 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

See ...this is just another example of a poor post! Show me where anybody predicted Kjerstad would have a -205 batting average. Is it poor comprehension, are just stupid, or are you hoping to get some free rep for saying something truly ridiculous like it was a fact.

Heres a fact for you absurd post, If Kjerstad hits .205 or anywhere close to it after year 2 in the majors he won’t be around very long. Also the only reason Chris Davis and his 27 million dollar contract didn’t make that list is he was essentially a part time player 139Ks in 352 ABs. 
 

Why would you only use players that make your argument ....As been said by someone else, Whitaker, Pedroia, Molitor (22 HRs was his highest), Wade Boggs (22 was highest and his second highest was 11). See, I can do it too!

The guy is widely considered to have the best bat in the draft. I have no idea what he will be anymore or less than you do! Same with Kjerstad! But, I still think he’s the better prospect and don’t think is by a narrow margin. That is my opinion....If I end up being wrong at very least I will be man enough to admit it! I’m betting most of the guys on the other side of it won’t.....wait and see! 
 

 

@ArtVanDelay Why are you confused???