Tex or AJ

[Sports Guy]

Its Tex and its not close.

[mweb]

Tex, but I think there needs to be contract totals for this to be accurate. Neither might be very appealing to me depending on what it takes to sign them. Or I might prefer AJ based on contracts.

[Sports Guy]

Tex, but I think there needs to be contract totals for this to be accurate. Neither might be very appealing to me depending on what it takes to sign them. Or I might prefer AJ based on contracts.

I think it is more likely AJ will get what he wants vs Tex getting what he wants.

[byrdz]

If you're going to give up the big bucks and lose a pick; go for the best player in the market.

[mweb]

I think it is more likely AJ will get what he wants vs Tex getting what he wants.

Yeah, and I'd also be more willing to give AJ what he wants compared to giving Tex what he(or Boras) wants.

[Canti]

I hate to say it but I'm starting doubt that we'll get Tex...

[Old#5fan]

Just because you don't understand the argument and don't recognize the talent we have in the minors, pitching wise, doesn;t mean it is a pointless and baseless argument.

It just means you continue to show this board your total ignorance about the game and the Orioles organization.

Just because your opinion is well, er your opinion doesn't mean it is infallibly right and I strongly disagree that the odds are good that more than one of the so-called minor league pitching prospects ever make good at the major league level, especially as starting pitchers.

From my experience the world is overloaded with so-called experts as well who turn out to be quite wrong. If you follow baseball as closely as you claim you also would know that unless you bury your head in the sand like an ostrich. So maybe you should look at your own total ignorance in that regard.

[Old#5fan]

BTW, doesn't improving the defense also improve the pitching?

Sure it does unless you got imposters like Daniel Cabrera pitching. He is even worse than Wakefield in allowing stolen bases so he walks a guy and most of the time it is the same as a double. What good is improving the defense when you got that type of ineptitude trotting out there every fifth day and sadly he is not even the worst starter on the Orioles staff (but close)? McPhail needs to clean house in the starting pitching department other than Guthrie and do it NOW.

[Old#5fan]

I am not necessarily disagreeing with you, but it depends a lot on what you think of the Orioles' minor league pitching. If you think we are loaded with guys who will be like Shields, Kazmir, Lester etc. in 2-3 years, but almost bereft of minor league bats, then it makes sense to go get a guy like Tex and rely on internal development for pitchers.

Personally I think we need to get a couple of solid starters to bridge the gap before the minor leaguers are ready and to hedge against the chance that they aren't as good as cracked up to be. But I wouldn't mind getting Tex, too.

Sadly, I think as usual, the pitching prospects in this organization are wildly over valued on this forum by many posters, and to a degree the position prospects as well although not nearly as much. Just looking at past history should tell you that:

a. Orioles pitching prospects rarely translate into highly sucessful major leaguers due to a number of reasons: lack of talent being one, inability to stay healthy being another, and inability to throw strikes even if they do have major league stuff

b. What is going to make that change?

c. We have had Eric Bedard and that is about it, ouit of all the pitching prospects to really pan out and now it appears his only real value was in a trade as had we hung on to him even he appears possibly worthless due to health issues. Adam Lowen was another example of hanging hopes on a highly touted and drafted prospect. To do this is nuts, when history shows that the Orioles are unsucessful the majority of times in developing starting pitching. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. This is what you have here.

So in summary, I am discounting totally anything significantly coming from any of the minor league so-called pitching prospects. If even one pans out I consider it a bonus. Now, moving forward Mr. McPhail needs to get busy and either sign some bonifide major league starters or trade for some. Time is always of the essence.

[Old#5fan]

Pitching is a strength in the minors. Scouts and other analysts have said we are loaded with starting pitching.

We have no hitting prospects in the minor leagues in the same stratosphere as Tex after Wieters.

Just look at Toronto, and you'll see pitching isn't everything. You've got to have an offense and right now, we need a whole new infield in 2010 to go with Wieters.

Tex is a good start to that infield and he allows you to sacrifice some offense at the other positions if need be.

Yeah, compared to the lack of strong position players in the Orioles minor leagues, I would agree there are more pitching prospects as scouts and other anlaysts have said. However, past sucess of translating those prospects to sucessful major league pitchers has been notoriously bad.

Simply having more prospects in number doesn't guarantee that more will suceed. That is a terrible assumption to base the future of the Orioles on. They need to go after proven Major League starting pitching NOW. I don't care if they have to trade every position player they have. If any of the so-called prospects do pan out they could always trade them for position players.

Right now if McPhail doesn't take major steps to improve the pitching he is simply not doing his job and I feel quite strongly about that. I don't want excuses, or unrealistic expectations of so-called prospects, I want results.

[Satyr3206]

Sadly, I think as usual, the pitching prospects in this organization are wildly over valued on this forum by many posters, and to a degree the position prospects as well although not nearly as much. Just looking at past history should tell you that:

a. Orioles pitching prospects rarely translate into highly sucessful major leaguers due to a number of reasons: lack of talent being one, inability to stay healthy being another, and inability to throw strikes even if they do have major league stuff

b. What is going to make that change?

c. We have had Eric Bedard and that is about it, ouit of all the pitching prospects to really pan out and now it appears his only real value was in a trad as had we hung on to him even he appears possibly worthless due to health issues

So in summary, I am discounting totally anything significantly coming from any of the minor league so-called pitching prospects. If even one pans out I consider it a bonus. Now, moving forward Mr. McPhail needs to get busy and either sign some bonifide major league starters or trade for some. Time is always of the essence.

I disagree about your MiL pitching assessment. Tillman, Matusz, and Arrieta are far superior pitchers, talent wise, than anyone drafted since Ben McDonald.

I agree it's very hard to project that to the ML level. Time will tell but it is a good sign we finally have some talent in the pipeline.

On another note, we have something in common. The same person thinks neither you or I know anything about baseball. Small world huh?

[PaulBako]

I am saying none.

[geschinger]

I disagree about your MiL pitching assessment. Tillman, Matusz, and Arrieta are far superior pitchers, talent wise, than anyone drafted since Ben McDonald.

Excellent Point... I don't think we've had many if any pitching prospects who will rank as highly on the BA top 100 or other lists as those guys will. The likelyhood of MLB success is much higher for these guys than it ever was for previous "top" prospects in our org.

[Old#5fan]

I disagree about your MiL pitching assessment. Tillman, Matusz, and Arrieta are far superior pitchers, talent wise, than anyone drafted since Ben McDonald.

I agree it's very hard to project that to the ML level. Time will tell but it is a good sign we finally have some talent in the pipeline.

On another note, we have something in common. The same person thinks neither you or I know anything about baseball. Small world huh?

Yeah, don't ya love it? Especially when he is touting the precise opposite of what needs to be done to improve this team the most. If I was McPhail I would mortgage my soul to purge this team of Daniel Cabrera, and the rest of the imposters who pose as bonifide major league starting pitchers and replace them with proven veterans. If they have to trade future draft picks, so be it. The whole losing mentality of this team will never change until they get some winning pitchers in here to change the complete pulse of the team. One would have to be deaf, dumb, and blind not to see that and pinning your hopes on prospects that are years away or may never pan out due to inability to make the transition, injury or whatever is simply repeating past mistakes over and over.

[geschinger]

Tex, but I think there needs to be contract totals for this to be accurate. Neither might be very appealing to me depending on what it takes to sign them. Or I might prefer AJ based on contracts.

Exactly.... Greatly exaggerting what they may get simply to illustrate the point, but say it took 4/52 to sign AJ and 10/220 to sign Tex... Then the answer is Burnett and it is an easy choice.