MLB Lockout Thread

[Too Tall]

In my judjement, a floor doesn't stop tanking. Just call any floor you set - A Tanking Target Floor. It would dictate the minimum you had to spend - not the quality of expenditures. If a team decides the best way to improve - long term - is lose and get good draft picks, it will find a way. And, an incentivised system giving  teams the oportunity to gather more/better draft picks by improving , not tanking, will only exascerbate an all ready warped system.  Define improve! Old Law of Physics - For Every Action, There Is An Equal and Opposite Reaction. Major League Baseball has broken itself and I'm not optimistic there is an agrreable cure. I have no sympothy for either side.  

[jarman86]

6 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

One thing to clarify here, the whole purpose of a floor is to make teams pay more for players instead of going cheap while tanking. it has nothing to do with competitiveness or awful teams to the MLBPA. They've made it very clear that they are about making more money and could care less about competitiveness across the league. They are worried about creating an environment where players make more money no matter what.

One thing to clarify, cause I feel you've been very anti-player through this whole process and wanting playes to agree to any deal that starts baseball ASAP.

The lockout has been MLB's doing, not the players. MLB could have negotiated with MLBPA without locking players out and threatening the season. MLB specifically stated their goal of the lockout was for a speedy resolution. They waited 6 weeks to propose to the MLBPA. They have made hardly any effort to find common ground. The average salary paid to players in an MLB season last year was I believe $340k, when you account guys are constantly on the up-down bus to minors, which, is more than the common man would ever make working a 9-5 job a year, but when a multi billion dollar industry where all profits go to owners or players, you are over here blaming the players and greed? I have no problem with players making more money and that is exactly what the union should be doing or they should be fired. C'mon! 

[Tony-OH]

2 hours ago, jarman86 said:

One thing to clarify, cause I feel you've been very anti-player through this whole process and wanting playes to agree to any deal that starts baseball ASAP.

The lockout has been MLB's doing, not the players. MLB could have negotiated with MLBPA without locking players out and threatening the season. MLB specifically stated their goal of the lockout was for a speedy resolution. They waited 6 weeks to propose to the MLBPA. They have made hardly any effort to find common ground. The average salary paid to players in an MLB season last year was I believe $340k, when you account guys are constantly on the up-down bus to minors, which, is more than the common man would ever make working a 9-5 job a year, but when a multi billion dollar industry where all profits go to owners or players, you are over here blaming the players and greed? I have no problem with players making more money and that is exactly what the union should be doing or they should be fired. C'mon! 

The average major league salary is over one million a year. Your numbers are not even close and reek of talking points by the MLBPA by  adding in players who spent partial season in the big leagues, especially a year after COVID where most teams used many more players from the minors, particularly pitchers.

The players have no interest in creating a more completive sport where all 30 teams have a chance with good management, but a system where it will force owners to pay mediocre players more money.

I could care less who gets more money between Billionaires and Millionaires, but I do care about having small market teams have a system where they can compete year in and year out.

The MLPBA is run by idiotic, money hungry men with no sense of care for the fans. The Owners are led by a world class douchebag who should be running a Bojangles in rural Alabama. There are no good guys in this situation, but the players have come out as the bad guys with their obvious distain for small and mid market teams and their fans.

So spare me the poor players routine because that doesn't fly when their main spokesman is a guy making over $40 million a year to make 34 starts a year. If Scherzer was a good guy, and he's really just an out of touch ultra rich elitist with distain for the common fan, he could take ten million of his contract every year and make all those "poor" up and down guys make the major league minimum of over $600K a year. 

As I've said many times, I'm disgusted with this entire situation but the players have complete and totally turned my off by the total and utter distain for the fan in these negaotiations.

 

[connja]

36 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

The average major league salary is over one million a year. Your numbers are not even close and reek of talking points by the MLBPA by  adding in players who spent partial season in the big leagues, especially a year after COVID where most teams used many more players from the minors, particularly pitchers.

The players have no interest in creating a more completive sport where all 30 teams have a chance with good management, but a system where it will force owners to pay mediocre players more money.

I could care less who gets more money between Billionaires and Millionaires, but I do care about having small market teams have a system where they can compete year in and year out.

The MLPBA is run by idiotic, money hungry men with no sense of care for the fans. The Owners are led by a world class douchebag who should be running a Bojangles in rural Alabama. There are no good guys in this situation, but the players have come out as the bad guys with their obvious distain for small and mid market teams and their fans.

So spare me the poor players routine because that doesn't fly when their main spokesman is a guy making over $40 million a year to make 34 starts a year. If Scherzer was a good guy, and he's really just an out of touch ultra rich elitist with distain for the common fan, he could take ten million of his contract every year and make all those "poor" up and down guys make the major league minimum of over $600K a year. 

As I've said many times, I'm disgusted with this entire situation but the players have complete and totally turned my off by the total and utter distain for the fan in these negaotiations.

 

Im for the players here.  While franchise values explode, player salaries are flat to down over the past couple years.  the players have come to the table.  the owners have not, taking weeks between meetings and proposals.  I don't feel bad for these guys making 40mm a year, but I respect that they are trying to get the younger guys paid a little sooner.

[Sports Guy]

This guy is right. 

[Sports Guy]

How bad is Manfred going to screw things up today?

[Can_of_corn]

12 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

This guy is right. 

But the players refused to be mediated.

[MCO'sFan]

9 hours ago, connja said:

Im for the players here.  While franchise values explode, player salaries are flat to down over the past couple years.  the players have come to the table.  the owners have not, taking weeks between meetings and proposals.  I don't feel bad for these guys making 40mm a year, but I respect that they are trying to get the younger guys paid a little sooner.

I am for neither side. I just want to enjoy baseball. All that is going to happen in the end is some money gets moved around and the fans will end up paying more to enjoy the games. That is the way it HAS always been and that is the way it WILL always be. 

[MCO'sFan]

26 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

How bad is Manfred going to screw things up today?

As bad as he possible can. 

[wildcard]

If he announces that they are delaying ST, they are messing with my baseball and I am pissed.   I don't care who's fault it is.

[spiritof66]

58 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

How bad is Manfred going to screw things up today?

Sometimes I find Mighty Manfred amusing to listen to because of his disregard for the truth, his lack of concern for consistency with what he's said before, and his pathological inability to accept responsibility for his own mistakes. Those traits are counter-productive for getting the players back on the field, but  when he gets going the result can be entertaining, sort of, in a perverse way.

[Tony-OH]

10 hours ago, connja said:

Im for the players here.  While franchise values explode, player salaries are flat to down over the past couple years.  the players have come to the table.  the owners have not, taking weeks between meetings and proposals.  I don't feel bad for these guys making 40mm a year, but I respect that they are trying to get the younger guys paid a little sooner.

I think you have to face facts, Scherzer is not trying to get the younger guys paid more, he's trying to get $50 million a year or more for himself. He's said nothing that makes me think he cares about anything other than himself and other veterans.

I get it, it's easy to not like the owners, heck, I don't like them either, but I'm calling out what I see from reading their comment and proposals and the players are not on your side. But, you are welcome to be on the players side.

I'll be honest, I'm very negative towards the players' stance, but I'm not on anyone's side but the fans of mid to small markets.

[Tony-OH]

57 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

But the players refused to be mediated.

Exactly. There's blame on both sides to go around. Again, neither side gives two hoots about the fans. 

[Tony-OH]

46 minutes ago, MCO'sFan said:

I am for neither side. I just want to enjoy baseball. All that is going to happen in the end is some money gets moved around and the fans will end up paying more to enjoy the games. That is the way it HAS always been and that is the way it WILL always be. 

Hear hear.. On point.

[SpOkane]

My proposal: Include MLBPA in League revenue sharing. They get 1/31 of the cut, probably over $200 Million. MLB & MLBPA negotiate how it gets divvied up in the following buckets:

• prearb players
• MILB players (salary & housing),
• support services and increased pensions for retired players (especially those who missed out on big paydays), and
• community outreach programs. 

MLBPA then decides on the mechanism that pays the prearb players. Could also include language that prearb salaries will not be used as base in arb hearings so MLBPA cannot be accused/tempted to inflate high end salaries to esclate arb prices. Empowers players to decide prearb worth and leavs owners out of it. 

I was also toying with the idea of a $25,000 "debut" bonus bucket for players who get called up to the 26-man roster. Some guys just get one day's pay and the story they made it to the Show, but also get lifetime access to MLB benefits.

Each team loses $6 million + in revenue sharing.  Seems like a drop in the bucket to them to get rid of some headaches and focus on making $.

Be also nice to see them think of fans-ticket price freeze over the course of this CBA.