Austin Hays 2022

[Pickles]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t know.  The payroll kept getting higher by a lot.  Either way, they didn’t capitalize on things when they needed to.  I hope this team doesn’t make the same mistake.

The "payroll kept getting higher by a lot" doesn't equal "they didn't capitalize on things when they needed to."

The fact is those Duquette and Buck teams mortgaged everything they possibly could in order to win more now.

[DrungoHazewood]

12 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t know.  The payroll kept getting higher by a lot.  Either way, they didn’t capitalize on things when they needed to.  I hope this team doesn’t make the same mistake.

I doubt that they do, if only because the payroll is starting at such a microscopic level that they could sign several $15-20M a year free agents and still be in the bottom 5 or 10 in the league.

[OriolesMagic83]

1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Did you?  How?  If you didn't live right next to the ballpark there's no way you watched more than a fraction of you favorite team's games, and very few of anyone else's.  In 1950 it was probably physically impossible to see more than 10-15% of MLB games.

If you lived in St. Louis and had season tickets to both the Browns and Cardinals and went to every game that would be watching 12.5% of all the games.

It was probably better to just read the newspaper and see if any players were noted as having an especially loud noise when they hit the ball.  Science!

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, Pickles said:

If they had truly made big mistakes after 2012 there wouldn't have been 2014.

And if there truly had been big mistakes after 2014 there wouldn't have been 2016.

You seem to think the only acceptable outcome is to make the playoffs every single year.

None of that is necessarily true.  They didn’t have to be that much better in 2013 and 2015 to make the playoffs.

And yes, I think it’s imperative to be in the playoffs when you have the chance to.  Those chances don’t always come around.  When you have that chance, you jump on it.  The purpose isn’t to have the #1 ranked farm system.  It’s to win.

[Sports Guy]

42 minutes ago, Pickles said:

The "payroll kept getting higher by a lot" doesn't equal "they didn't capitalize on things when they needed to."

The fact is those Duquette and Buck teams mortgaged everything they possibly could in order to win more now.

No they didn’t. 

[OriolesMagic83]

48 minutes ago, Pickles said:

The "payroll kept getting higher by a lot" doesn't equal "they didn't capitalize on things when they needed to."

The fact is those Duquette and Buck teams mortgaged everything they possibly could in order to win more now.

I think after Dan tried and failed to go to Toronto, Buck basically became co-GM.  Maybe Brady was the 3rd GM.  I think if Dan had just resigned, he would have had much more respect around baseball.

[Frobby]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

No they didn’t. 

Yeah they did.  Traded Arrieta.  Traded Rodriguez.  Traded Davies.   Traded Heim.  All for 2 month rentals.   

[Pickles]

15 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

No they didn’t. 

I mean they had record payrolls, doled out unwise FA contracts, traded draft picks, and basically every prospect who wasn't nailed down.

Not every thing worked out for them, obviously, but they happily mortgaged every bit of the O's future for the success of 2012-16.

What more realistically did you want them to do?  I remember half the board in an uproar for the damage to the future, even while we were winning.

[OriolesMagic83]

Just now, Pickles said:

I mean they had record payrolls, doled out unwise FA contracts, traded draft picks, and basically every prospect who wasn't nailed down.

Not every thing worked out for them, obviously, but they happily mortgaged every bit of the O's future for the success of 2012-16.

What more realistically did you want them to do?  I remember half the board in an uproar for the damage to the future, even while we were winning.

I think a good percentage of the board wanted a rebuild after 2016.  After 2017, I would say the writing was on the wall. 

[Just Regular]

2 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I think a good percentage of the board wanted a rebuild after 2016.  After 2017, I would say the writing was on the wall. 

I can kind of imagine Brady writing the unrefusable offer to Alex Cobb on a wall.

[Pickles]

32 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

None of that is necessarily true.  They didn’t have to be that much better in 2013 and 2015 to make the playoffs.

And yes, I think it’s imperative to be in the playoffs when you have the chance to.  Those chances don’t always come around.  When you have that chance, you jump on it.  The purpose isn’t to have the #1 ranked farm system.  It’s to win.

The purpose imo is to win consistently.  This is something I was thinking about the other day, but if you had the choice between winning 90 games every year and alternating between winning 100 and 80 every other year, which would you take?

I'd take the 90 every year.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Pickles

[Pickles]

8 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I think a good percentage of the board wanted a rebuild after 2016.  After 2017, I would say the writing was on the wall. 

The longest thread on the board in the year 2014, our only division title of this millennium, was about the need to rebuild.

Fans like to be contrarian.  

[Pickles]

22 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I think after Dan tried and failed to go to Toronto, Buck basically became co-GM.  Maybe Brady was the 3rd GM.  I think if Dan had just resigned, he would have had much more respect around baseball.

I'm tired of the old speculation, but regardless of who was making the decisions, they were clearly willing to mortgage the future for the present.

[pastorfan]

18 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Yeah they did.  Traded Arrieta.  Traded Rodriguez.  Traded Davies.   Traded Heim.  All for 2 month rentals.   

I would say they did not. They lost Cruz and Markakis after the 2014 season and made no significant additions and this was during a "down" time for NY and Boston. Then to try to replace what the lost with Cruz and Markakis they made some terrible trades, as you note.

[Pickles]

4 minutes ago, pastorfan said:

I would say they did not. They lost Cruz and Markakis after the 2014 season and made no significant additions and this was during a "down" time for NY and Boston. Then to try to replace what the lost with Cruz and Markakis they made some terrible trades, as you note.

They replaced Cruz with Trumbo and then gave him an unwise longterm extension.  Was he not a significant addition?