Latest Mock Has Elias Screwing Up Another 1st Rd Pick

[RZNJ]

32 minutes ago, emmett16 said:

If I were Dru Jones and got drafted by the Orioles, no way am I taking the money.  I’m taking my game somewhere else for a year and getting drafted by another team.  Even with the added year, he’s likely to make MLB faster.  I’m afraid of the long term consequences with player relations of the ridiculous slow playing to manipulate control.  They are fn with these kids lives and it is not a good look.  

So, he's going to get the majors faster by going to a junior/community college for a year and then getting drafted by another team?

Give up a guaranteed 8M to play another year as an amateur to maybe get to the majors a few months earlier, at best?   You would do that?    I give you more credit than that.

 

[emmett16]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

So, he's going to get the majors faster by going to a junior/community college for a year and then getting drafted by another team?

Give up a guaranteed 8M to play another year as an amateur to maybe get to the majors a few months earlier, at best?   You would do that?    I give you more credit than that.

 

I think he, in particular, has more options than most HS guys.  Agents talk to their players about all the different organizations and I can’t imagine there is much positive said about being drafted by the Os.  They are going to try and low ball you upfront, slow roll you to MLB, and be stingy when it comes to an extension or FA signing.  I’m mostly concerned about the optics of how they operate and the impact it has to future signees.  I can’t see anyone getting giddy to get drafted by Baltimore.  I think any player that’s has options will weigh them heavily and Jones more so than others has those options. 

[RZNJ]

3 hours ago, emmett16 said:

I think he, in particular, has more options than most HS guys.  Agents talk to their players about all the different organizations and I can’t imagine there is much positive said about being drafted by the Os.  They are going to try and low ball you upfront, slow roll you to MLB, and be stingy when it comes to an extension or FA signing.  I’m mostly concerned about the optics of how they operate and the impact it has to future signees.  I can’t see anyone getting giddy to get drafted by Baltimore.  I think any player that’s has options will weigh them heavily and Jones more so than others has those options. 

I can't argue that the extra year of service time and the super two don't come into play.   However, it seems to me the Orioles now have a pretty good reputation regarding development.   Yeah, it's possible Jones might hit FA a year later with the Orioles than he would with Arizona or Texas or whoever but I don't think that's enough to turn down 8M and wait another year to take the same amount of money.  As a position player their isn't a whole lot of risk in doing it but he'd be competing against inferior players compared to what he'd be facing in the pros.   I would say that it might not hurt his development but it certainly wouldn't help it.   I'm not sure he gets to the majors faster by doing that.   Maybe.   If that's the case, I would think Jones might put the word out there and give Arizona a chance to go overslot with the second pick and let the Orioles know that he doesn't want them to pick him.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, RZNJ said:

I can't argue that the extra year of service time and the super two don't come into play.   However, it seems to me the Orioles now have a pretty good reputation regarding development.   Yeah, it's possible Jones might hit FA a year later with the Orioles than he would with Arizona or Texas or whoever but I don't think that's enough to turn down 8M and wait another year to take the same amount of money.  As a position player their isn't a whole lot of risk in doing it but he'd be competing against inferior players compared to what he'd be facing in the pros.   I would say that it might not hurt his development but it certainly wouldn't help it.   I'm not sure he gets to the majors faster by doing that.   Maybe.   If that's the case, I would think Jones might put the word out there and give Arizona a chance to go overslot with the second pick and let the Orioles know that he doesn't want them to pick him.

I don't see why it would be seen as anything special.  Some successes some failures.  Like every team.

[Can_of_corn]

Shame draftees can't bargain for ML contacts anymore.

[RZNJ]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't see why it would be seen as anything special.  Some successes some failures.  Like every team.

Did I say special?   I said they had a good reputation, IMO.   No reason for a player not to want to play in their system.   Same as any every other team?   I don't know of a team with a bad reputation for developing players but I think in previous Oriole regimes there was a disconnect between the scouting department and the developmental department.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, RZNJ said:

Did I say special?   I said they had a good reputation, IMO.   No reason for a player not to want to play in their system.   Same as any every other team?   I don't know of a team with a bad reputation for developing players but I think in previous Oriole regimes there was a disconnect between the scouting department and the developmental department.

You said pretty good.  I said not anything special.

You think that was worth pushing back on? 

They seem pretty average to me.  To me average is not anything special.  Pretty good would be above average.

[RZNJ]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

You said pretty good.  I said not anything special.

You think that was worth pushing back on? 

They seem pretty average to me.  To me average is not anything special.  Pretty good would be above average.

You've won another nitpick contest. Your trophy will be in the mail.   

[Chaka Garcia]

15 hours ago, emmett16 said:

I think he, in particular, has more options than most HS guys.  Agents talk to their players about all the different organizations and I can’t imagine there is much positive said about being drafted by the Os.  They are going to try and low ball you upfront, slow roll you to MLB, and be stingy when it comes to an extension or FA signing.  I’m mostly concerned about the optics of how they operate and the impact it has to future signees.  I can’t see anyone getting giddy to get drafted by Baltimore.  I think any player that’s has options will weigh them heavily and Jones more so than others has those options. 

This doesn’t make sense. It would be dumb to give up 8plus million and get your pro career started to go to community college just to avoid the O’s who game the service clock like every other team.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Chaka Garcia said:

This doesn’t make sense. It would be dumb to give up 8plus million and get your pro career started to go to community college just to avoid the O’s who game the service clock like every other team.

Please show me where every other team games the service clock like the O's under Elias.

[Frobby]

24 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Please show me where every other team games the service clock like the O's under Elias.

I think it would be hard to prove one way or another.  Every player’s circumstances are different.  

But as to Jones, how likely is it really that he would get to the majors sooner by starting his pro career a year later?  I seriously doubt he wouldn’t sign because of worrying about being slow rolled.   

 

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I think it would be hard to prove one way or another.  Every player’s circumstances are different.  

But as to Jones, how likely is it really that he would get to the majors sooner by starting his pro career a year later?  I seriously doubt he wouldn’t sign because of worrying about being slow rolled.   

 

It wouldn't be hard to disprove because the other poster stated "every".   

Clearly "every" team doesn't do it to the extent the Orioles under Elias do.

Just look at Tampa, Seattle and Kansas City this season. 

[Frobby]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

It wouldn't be hard to disprove because the other poster stated "every".   

Clearly "every" team doesn't do it to the extent the Orioles under Elias do.

Just look at Tampa, Seattle and Kansas City this season. 

You are talking about one season, but I had a longer time frame in mind.  But, I agree that if you say “every” there are undoubtedly several teams who promote more aggressively.   I still don’t think Jones would want to delay his pro debut by a year.   Too many things can go wrong in the intervening period that could knock him off his no. 1 perch, plus as I said, delaying his pro career by a year isn’t likely to accelerate his major league debut.  

[Sports Guy]

There is zero chance Jones declines the money and goes to school.  Let’s just stop talking about it.  

[Chaka Garcia]

15 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

There is zero chance Jones declines the money and goes to school.  Let’s just stop talking about it.  

I concur! Let’s stop talking about this nonsense, he’s taking the money.