Best thing the Orioles can do is trade Kyle Stowers

[interloper]

If McKenna can drop a pop-up and still get plenty of run, Stowers should be able to get run after his error. 

The difference is, McKenna has made more of his opportunities at the plate than Stowers has. But we're still only talking about 24 ABs here for Stowers. I want to see a few more games out of him, though he won't be in there tonight against the LHP. 

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, interloper said:

If McKenna can drop a pop-up and still get plenty of run, Stowers should be able to get run after his error. 

The difference is, McKenna has made more of his opportunities at the plate than Stowers has. But we're still only talking about 24 ABs here for Stowers. I want to see a few more games out of him, though he won't be in there tonight against the LHP. 

We're also talking about what Stowers showed at the plate last year which was solid...he's not shown that this year.  

I agree, it's a small sample size and despite my hesitations about what he brings to the table, I still think he should get playing time because the Cowser/Kjerstad squeeze will be here in a month or two.  

[Hank Scorpio]

Kyle Stowers was a top 10 prospect in the best system in baseball. He's not a "fringe" prospect. McKenna was a fringe prospect and has turned into something of value. I guess. I'm not convinced he's any more valuable than a guy like Haskins or Daz Cameron.

Stowers is a guy that is stuck behind average ML regulars (sans Mullins) that would have a chance to be a pretty potent left handed bat with more reps, but he's not going to get that here. I agree with the opening premise here but I'm not sure the organization sees it that way with him shuttling back and forth. If they were considering dealing him, he'd be getting consistent at bats somewhere. 

I still can't figure out why the heck they don't give him more reps vs. lefties. I realize ML lefties > MiL lefties, but... 

https://www.camdenchat.com/2022/10/21/23413175/orioles-prospect-season-in-review-kyle-stowers

Hyde’s reluctance to play Stowers against lefties was puzzling, considering the 24-year-old was anything but a platoon player at Triple-A. Stowers hit left-handers at a sensational clip at Norfolk, batting .330/.441/.577 in a 118-PA sample size. And that wasn’t a one-year fluke. In 2021, he hit .292/.384/.567 with nine homers in 138 PAs versus lefties. That the Orioles didn’t give him even one start to test his mettle against a big-league left-hander feels like a real missed opportunity for a player they’re trying to evaluate.

[foxfield]

I root for Stowers.  I like what I think he can be.

I have not subscribed to the "Stowers is hated" or being "mishandled" or even "mistreated" has been used.

He is a tough spot because, he is unproven and if he wants to unseat someone he is going to have to make something out of his opportunities.  But I also think Cowser and Kjerstad are coming and therefore he is pressed from both sides.
 

I think it could still go either way, but I don't see Stowers being misused.  He isn't the first choice and his play has justified that.  SSS yada yada yada, but I do hope he gets it going.  I think having options is great.

But I think fringe is the right word.  He could have a role here...or elsewhere.

[Hank Scorpio]

He's a guy that most likely needs an injury to get time.

But the fact of the matter is even with an injury or a trade, there's a good chance the org will stick Cowser out there. Obviously this is a perfectly defensible, reasonable thing to do. Cowser is legit and definitely a better prospect than Stowers was. 

We are fortunate to have talented depth. I would expect that we'll see some kind of movement prior to the trade deadline.

[Moose Milligan]

I agree that Stowers should get at bats against lefties.

[sportsfan8703]

Stowers has been given an opportunity.  We're playing winning baseball.  Stowers needs to produce when he gets Playing Time.  He's 25.  I like the guy and root for him, but it's time to put up some results.  These guys have been playing baseball their entire life.  No more excuses.  When your number is called... Produce.  

[Frobby]

12 hours ago, Pickles said:

I just went back through the game and watched it.

I might not be little league bad, but it's AAA bad.

Look, he's getting what was asked for: A little run.

He ain't doing much with it.

That’s the thing.  In his previous stints, people complained he wasn’t playing enough.  This time around, he’s played in all 9 games since he returned, starting 6 of them, and he’s hitting .100/.143/.100.   Unlike Gunnar, who will be given a lot of rope, Stowers probably won’t get sustained playing time unless he starts playing better in his next couple of opportunities.   That’s just the position he’s in.  

[Sports Guy]

38 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

Kyle Stowers was a top 10 prospect in the best system in baseball. He's not a "fringe" prospect. McKenna was a fringe prospect and has turned into something of value. I guess. I'm not convinced he's any more valuable than a guy like Haskins or Daz Cameron.

Stowers is a guy that is stuck behind average ML regulars (sans Mullins) that would have a chance to be a pretty potent left handed bat with more reps, but he's not going to get that here. I agree with the opening premise here but I'm not sure the organization sees it that way with him shuttling back and forth. If they were considering dealing him, he'd be getting consistent at bats somewhere. 

I still can't figure out why the heck they don't give him more reps vs. lefties. I realize ML lefties > MiL lefties, but... 

https://www.camdenchat.com/2022/10/21/23413175/orioles-prospect-season-in-review-kyle-stowers

Hyde’s reluctance to play Stowers against lefties was puzzling, considering the 24-year-old was anything but a platoon player at Triple-A. Stowers hit left-handers at a sensational clip at Norfolk, batting .330/.441/.577 in a 118-PA sample size. And that wasn’t a one-year fluke. In 2021, he hit .292/.384/.567 with nine homers in 138 PAs versus lefties. That the Orioles didn’t give him even one start to test his mettle against a big-league left-hander feels like a real missed opportunity for a player they’re trying to evaluate.

Nice to see some knowledge and common sense brought into this thread instead of knee jerk over the top observations based on 7 at bats.

[sportsfan8703]

10 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Nice to see some knowledge and common sense brought into this thread instead of knee jerk over the top observations based on 7 at bats.

I really like Stowers, but he's got 125 PA spread over two seasons.  With two full MLB ST.  Meaning he's had time to make adjustments and work on his flaws.  We need this dude.  That's why it's time to produce.  We aren't a 100 loss team that can just pencil him in RF every game.  It's time for him to do something.  

[foxfield]

15 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

I really like Stowers, but he's got 125 PA spread over two seasons.  With two full MLB ST.  Meaning he's had time to make adjustments and work on his flaws.  We need this dude.  That's why it's time to produce.  We aren't a 100 loss team that can just pencil him in RF every game.  It's time for him to do something.  

Yes, Stowers is a good player and could be a big help, but he isn't going to get the leash Gunner is and the Orioles in competition no longer have the luxury they did in sticking Mateo or Urias out there everyday and just rolling.  I hope he can get it going, but it is a tough environment and that is a very good thing.  We are always too quick here.  McKenna would have been simply released after Boston.  That would have been a mistake. Stowers should keep getting chances...but he is going to have to produce or someone else will get the chance.

[Sydnor]

2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

To me a fringe prospect is someone who has a shot to be more than organizational filler.  I would call Stowers a fringe major leaguer.

I think this is a good definition and Stowers as a fringe major leaguer and McKenna as a viable bench piece is also a good take. I like Stowers, but haven’t understood why he’s viewed as a key piece of the future and McKenna is viewed as DFA fodder. Getting to the point:

In 2021, Fangraphs viewed McKenna as the 7th ranked prospect in the system and gave him a 45 FV. His current age is approximately 26 years and 3 months. In his age 24 season at AAA, he had 123 plate appearances with a .307/.423/.683 slash line with a 187 wRC+ and .463 wOBA. He struck out 26.8% of the time and walked 17.1% of the time. In 2019, at AA (age 22), he wasn’t great at AA, with a .232/.321/.365 slash line with a 104 wRC+ and a .315 wOBA. He struck out 21.3% of the time and walked 10.4% of the time. I can’t find Tony’s write-ups from back then but Fangraphs had him as a 40/45 hit, 45/45 raw power, 70/70 speed, and 55/60 field. 

In 2022, Fangraphs viewed Stowers as the 9th ranked prospect in the system and gave him a 45 FV. His current age is approximately 25 years and 4 months (about 11 months younger than McKenna). In his age 24 season at AAA, he had 407 plate appearances with a slash line of .264/.357/.527 with a 130 wRC+ and a .381 wOBA. He struck out 25.6% of the time and walked 11.1% of the time. In 2021 at AA (age 23), he had a slash line of .283/.377/.561 with a wRC+ of 152 and a .401 wOBA. He struck out 30.4% of the time and walked 12.3% of the time. Fangraphs had him as a 35/40 hit, 45/55 game power, 55/65 raw power, 50/50 speed, and 50/55 field.

In summary, I view McKenna and Stowers fairly similarly. Stowers has a chance to be a more impactful MLB player because of his power, but McKenna has always had value, he just provides it in different ways and never should have been a DFA candidate for dropping a ball. If you told me in 10 years that McKenna had a better career I wouldn’t be shocked.

[sportsfan8703]

54 minutes ago, foxfield said:

Yes, Stowers is a good player and could be a big help, but he isn't going to get the leash Gunner is and the Orioles in competition no longer have the luxury they did in sticking Mateo or Urias out there everyday and just rolling.  I hope he can get it going, but it is a tough environment and that is a very good thing.  We are always too quick here.  McKenna would have been simply released after Boston.  That would have been a mistake. Stowers should keep getting chances...but he is going to have to produce or someone else will get the chance.

That will be Cowser once the super two date passes in mid June.  

[Hank Scorpio]

47 minutes ago, foxfield said:

Yes, Stowers is a good player and could be a big help, but he isn't going to get the leash Gunner is and the Orioles in competition no longer have the luxury they did in sticking Mateo or Urias out there everyday and just rolling.  I hope he can get it going, but it is a tough environment and that is a very good thing.  We are always too quick here.  McKenna would have been simply released after Boston.  That would have been a mistake. Stowers should keep getting chances...but he is going to have to produce or someone else will get the chance.

Agree with this... and there are at bats to be had. The question is isn't so much is he a better option than Hays or Santander.

It's more is he a better option than Frazier or McCann, especially now with Urias on the IL. There's obviously pressure. Cowser is baked and ready to go. 

[interloper]

5 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

Agree with this... and there are at bats to be had. The question is isn't so much is he a better option than Hays or Santander.

It's more is he a better option than Frazier or McCann, especially now with Urias on the IL. There's obviously pressure. Cowser is baked and ready to go. 

I agree that Cowser is ready to go, but Elias doesn't, unfortunately. In his media scrum yesterday, he pretty much said Cowser hasn't graduated AAA yet and it would be awhile.