Ohtani Rental?

[foxfield]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Where would you draw the line on an Ohtani deal?

 

1 hour ago, RVAOsFan said:

No guys: Adley, Gunnar, Westburg, Cowser, Holliday, Mayo, Kjerstad, GRod

I think anyone else is game as a center piece and no more than 2 top 100ish guys.  If I am making this deal I would rather deal more quantity from our depth than top tier.

Example: Basallo, Norby, Stowers,Mateo and a lottery ticket if required 

Something like this would be the limit for me as well.  I just cannot justify more.  You are going to have to make a move in the off season to replace your 2 month rental...and that makes me less willing to send more.  You would regret it.  Unless....of course.

[Bemorewins]

37 minutes ago, bpilktree67 said:

The Angels are 3 out in the Wild card they are not going to sell now.  They are playing well and other teams are falling back.  They have hoped the Mariners and just one back of the Yanks.  

I'm indifferent toward the Angels and their decision as an O's fan. But I think that would be a big mistake for them. So, they hang on to Ohtani for the year fight for a Wildcard and then what? Unless they make a very improbable postseason run Ohtani is likely leaving. What are going to sell him on to resign? "Oh hey come back to us, the place that you've known nothing but team mediocrity for the last 6 years, where you're talents will continue to be wasted in a roster that is not very good? Don't go to the Dodgers where you will play with 2 other stars in their prime and be in the postseason likely every season for the foreseeable future?" And if he will entertain teams outside of the West Coast/California, "No. Don't go the the Mets, where they will likely pay you way more than we can with their gazillionaire owner"?

[interloper]

1 hour ago, RVAOsFan said:

No guys: Adley, Gunnar, Westburg, Cowser, Holliday, Mayo, Kjerstad, GRod

I think anyone else is game as a center piece and no more than 2 top 100ish guys.  If I am making this deal I would rather deal more quantity from our depth than top tier.

Example: Basallo, Norby, Stowers,Mateo and a lottery ticket if required 

We have to start realizing that LA will require a trade to be headlined by the best possible SP prospect we can offer. @Can_of_cornmentioned Grayson and it sounds crazy but it's really not. This is the kind of thing it will take to pry Ohtani away from LA's owners. 

You MUST include pitching to get pitching. It's non-negotiable. There is no scenario in which we give up only position player prospects and a low-A pitcher or two. If you're not at least starting with Povich and Hall and our second best position player prospect after Holliday (whether that's Mayo or Westburg or Cowser or Kjerstad), it's a no go. 

Edited July 26, 2023 by interloper

[Bemorewins]

1 minute ago, foxfield said:

 

Something like this would be the limit for me as well.  I just cannot justify more.  You are going to have to make a move in the off season to replace your 2 month rental...and that makes me less willing to send more.  You would regret it.  Unless....of course.

Actually you won't though. When Means returns next season fully healthy hopefully, we will have 5-7 starters with Bradish, Wells, Means, Kremer, Gibson (with Irvin and probably Seth Johnson as depth).

As far as DH (lineup goes) Kjerstad will be ready to play on Opening Day of next year and probably Mayo not too far behind.

[foxfield]

8 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

Actually you won't though. When Means returns next season fully healthy hopefully, we will have 5-7 starters with Bradish, Wells, Means, Kremer, Gibson (with Irvin and probably Seth Johnson as depth).

As far as DH (lineup goes) Kjerstad will be ready to play on Opening Day of next year and probably Mayo not too far behind.

Wait what?

So, the 23 Orioles need to send 5 very good controllable players to the Angels so we can increase our chance at winning in the playoffs in 23.  THEN Ohtani is a FA and he isn't signing here.  BUT we don't need to be concerned with that because John Means will be fully back.

But this year we must do something or we can't compete in the playoffs against the big boys.

Question:

IF all of that above is true?  Why wouldn't you roll the dice now, keep all of those guys.  Who is to say Means won't hit the ground running now?

[Billy F-Face3]

16 minutes ago, interloper said:

We have to start realizing that LA will require a trade to be headlined by the best possible SP prospect we can offer. @Can_of_cornmentioned Grayson and it sounds crazy but it's really not. This is the kind of thing it will take to pry Ohtani away from LA's owners. 

You MUST include pitching to get pitching. It's non-negotiable. There is no scenario in which we give up only position player prospects and a low-A pitcher or two. If you're not at least starting with Povich and Hall and our second best position player prospect after Holliday (whether that's Mayo or Westburg or Cowser or Kjerstad), it's a no go. 

What is your thoughts about trading John Means? He's got 1 more year of arbitration (getting paid millions) and then he's a free agent. He will be back by the end of August/beginning of September.

[interloper]

2 minutes ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

What is your thoughts about trading John Means? He's got 1 more year of arbitration (getting paid millions) and then he's a free agent. He will be back by the end of August/beginning of September.

Nothing is impossible, although it would feel a little rough to do that to the guy. Also I don't know that he's all that enticing as a centerpiece for Ohtani. If I'm the Angels, I'm only giving up Ohtani if it means I get a controllable pitcher for many years. 

Edited July 26, 2023 by interloper

[Tryptamine]

1 hour ago, bpilktree67 said:

The Angels are 3 out in the Wild card they are not going to sell now.  They are playing well and other teams are falling back.  They have hoped the Mariners and just one back of the Yanks.  

The market really has the possibility to shrink over the next few days. If the angels keep winning then Ohtani is out. If the Cubs keep winning Stroman and Bellinger are out. ESPN has already reported that the Padres are likely keeping Snell and Hader.  That basically takes the pitchers who are significant upgrades down to 3. Eduardo Rodriguez, Lucas Giolito and Jordan Montgomery and with only 3 pitchers on the market the price is going to go up. If I were an Oriole fan I'd be hoping the Angels, Padres and Cubs start losing asap if for nothing else but to have more options on the market. 

[RZNJ]

1.  The Angels probably don’t even trade Ohtani

2. Mike Elias would never outbid other teams in terms of prospects

It’s that simple.

[Bemorewins]

22 minutes ago, interloper said:

We have to start realizing that LA will require a trade to be headlined by the best possible SP prospect we can offer. @Can_of_cornmentioned Grayson and it sounds crazy but it's really not. This is the kind of thing it will take to pry Ohtani away from LA's owners. 

You MUST include pitching to get pitching. It's non-negotiable. There is no scenario in which we give up only position player prospects and a low-A pitcher or two. If you're not at least starting with Povich and Hall and our second best position player prospect after Holliday (whether that's Mayo or Westburg or Cowser or Kjerstad), it's a no go. 

I can't envision a scenario where the Orioles or any other (realistic) suitor will give the Angels a young asset on par with Grayson Rodriguez for 2 months of Ohtani.

Povich I would include in a trade in heartbeat. But Grayson is our only seriously valuable young pitching asset unless you want to consider Bradish to be that (he's only 26). Obviously the O's aren't moving neither.

Hall I can't see with any real trade value or appeal to other teams, other than as a reclamation project (extremely buy low guy and take a chance). He is of the age where he had lost almost any sort of prospect status. Plus he has not ever shown dominance at the AAA level yet.

[Bemorewins]

8 minutes ago, Tryptamine said:

The market really has the possibility to shrink over the next few days. If the angels keep winning then Ohtani is out. If the Cubs keep winning Stroman and Bellinger are out. ESPN has already reported that the Padres are likely keeping Snell and Hader.  That basically takes the pitchers who are significant upgrades down to 3. Eduardo Rodriguez, Lucas Giolito and Jordan Montgomery and with only 3 pitchers on the market the price is going to go up. If I were an Oriole fan I'd be hoping the Angels, Padres and Cubs start losing asap if for nothing else but to have more options on the market. 

Bellinger, the Orioles have no interest in trading for. Elias has already stated on a few occasions that they are not interested in adding a bat.

We have an overabundance of prospect capital (more than we can ever use). If those teams do not decide to trade, we are good. We can get whoever on the market we want and be fine. There will be no panic/anxiety here, we are very well positioned to succeed both now and into the project future.

[Billy F-Face3]

11 minutes ago, Tryptamine said:

 If I were an Oriole fan 

You're not an Orioles fan?

[sportsfan8703]

Ohtani makes even more sense with Hicks and Mullins out. Hader likely needed too. Just keep Mayo, Kjerstad, Basallo, and Holliday. 

[Tryptamine]

9 minutes ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

You're not an Orioles fan?

I've been registered here since 2009 and people are still just finding this out. 

[Billy F-Face3]

Just now, Tryptamine said:

I've been registered here since 2009 and people are still just finding this out. 

Ive been registered here since 2023, so...