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Time for Bergesen to go back down (update: Bergesen sent down)

Tony-OH

By Tony-OH
in Orioles Talk

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RShack Hangout Grand Counsel

RShack

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This.

Tonight Bergy looked decent until his defense let him down. Then he rushed the ball to the plate horribly and kept the ball up. It's almost like he didn't trust his defense enough to throw his sinker again.

You didn't see him rshack... he just lost it out there. I agree with SG. He needs to go down and work on his mentality and confidence.

You're right, I didn't see him. All I know is what I got from the game thread. What I got from that was that he started out a little shaky, then started getting GB-out after GB-out, and then had that horrendous inning. Then, next thing I know, everybody seems to have climbed on the send-him-down bandwagon....

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Three Run Homer Hangout Veteran Council

Three Run Homer

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He needs outstanding command to succeed and right now he doesn't have command of either his sinker or his breaking pitch.

I just think he's still rusty after the long layoff from pitching. He needs to work out his problems in Norfolk. I think he'll be fine long term, but he has options and we need to use them. My preference would be to give Arietta a shot, but if the organization thinks he's not quite ready then this is what we have Berken and Hendrickson for.

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Lucky Jim Hangout Grand Counsel

Lucky Jim

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You're right, I didn't see him. All I know is what I got from the game thread. What I got from that was that he started out a little shaky, then started getting GB out after GB out, and then had that horrendous inning. Then, next thing I know, everybody seems to have climbed on the send-him-down bandwagon....

His location was bad. His movement was inconsistent. His mechanics (and delivery) were hurried.

They hit some good pitches. Crushed some bad ones. They didn't miss any.

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Three Run Homer Hangout Veteran Council

Three Run Homer

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You're right, I didn't see him. All I know is what I got from the game thread. What I got from that was that he started out a little shaky, then started getting GB-out after GB-out, and then had that horrendous inning. Then, next thing I know, everybody seems to have climbed on the send-him-down bandwagon....

Even in the 2nd innings those GBs were hit pretty hard.

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backwardsk Hangout Grand Counsel

backwardsk

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You're right, I didn't see him. All I know is what I got from the game thread. What I got from that was that he started out a little shaky, then started getting GB out after GB out, and then had that horrendous inning. Then, next thing I know, everybody seems to have climbed on the send-him-down bandwagon....

Uh, he got a double play and two other ground outs. That's it. This isn't last season's rotation where there weren't any available options that were ready. This season, they have Arrieta, Berken, and even Simon to turn to. Bergesen has options and could benefit from a demotion, IMO.

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isestrex Hangout Grand Counsel

isestrex

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You're right, I didn't see him. All I know is what I got from the game thread. What I got from that was that he started out a little shaky, then started getting GB-out after GB-out, and then had that horrendous inning. Then, next thing I know, everybody seems to have climbed on the send-him-down bandwagon....

Yes he settled into a groove but he lost composer out there quick. That's not something he should stay up here to work on. I think there's a 95% chance he goes back down.

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

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Tony, how many more starts do you think they'll give him before opting for demotion? Are they on verge of doing it right now?

I think you have enough to send him down now. He was pretty bad in spring training minus that one start against the Yankees and he's been terrible and all three starts. His command is just terrible and his body language tells me he's really, really shaken by his inability to throw the ball where he wants.

If this was just a case of a guy missing some spots here and there I'd say give him a few more starts, but he looks like a wreck out there right now. With Arrieta dominating AAA, I think you make the switch now.

Hopefully he just needs more time to get back to where he was, because not only is his command off on both his sinker and slider, but the slider has backed up and is no where near the pitch it was last year.

It's tough to watch a guy melt down as quickly as he has, but his mound presence is absolutely terrible as well. Right now he doesn't look like a good Double-A pitcher.

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

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You're right, I didn't see him. All I know is what I got from the game thread. What I got from that was that he started out a little shaky, then started getting GB-out after GB-out, and then had that horrendous inning. Then, next thing I know, everybody seems to have climbed on the send-him-down bandwagon....

Right, because clearly it is only that one inning why everyone wants to see him demoted? :rolleyes:

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RVAbird All-Star

RVAbird

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What now? Reward Arrieta for an excellent start to 2010, or slot Berken into that spot in the rotation?

Berken has been excellent in this role. He was born to be a reliever IMO. I really hope they don't plug him into the rotation and mess up a good thing.

If it were me I'd probably give Bergesen another shot. His stuff was mixed early and he was obviously rattled after the error. I don't want to reward him for losing his composure but if there's not a legitimate mechanical issue there's no reason to burn an option and potentially add someone to the 40-man. I'd give him another shot to assess his mechanics and see how he looks.

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

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I'd give Bergesen a couple of more starts to find himself. First of all, I'd like to see Arrieta continue to improve before he comes up. Secondly, I thought Bergesen looked pretty close to the 2009 Bergesen. He couldn't locate his slider at all and he did seem to fall apart when things went bad. Still, I think he deserves a longer leash than three starts.

You and I were watching two different games then. Bergesen could not locate his slider at all and his fastball was very inconsistent. He threw some good ones here and there, but he also missed in the middle of the plate and up too much.

His lack of composure when things go bad was alarming to say the least.

I take absolutely no pleasure at all saying these things, but if I was scouting him based off what I saw tonight I'd be putting up a big NP next to his name.

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BaltimoreTerp Hangout Grand Counsel

BaltimoreTerp

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Here's my question.

After last season (and even during the year) there was some discussion about how Bergesen's peripheral numbers suggested he wouldn't be able to repeat last season's success.

Is it possible the issue isn't whether he can return to last season's form but whether he's just regressing to a more natural level?

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

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And I said exactly that in my post. On the plus side, I did see the fastball with good movement on it for 2+ innings. Sure, overall he was terrible, but I'm not sure he's that far off. Like I said, I think he deserves a couple of more starts to get it together. I'm not ready to say he's hopeless and a return to AAA is the only solution.

There is a major difference between calling someone hopeless and thinking he should go down and work on things in the minor leagues.

I still think Bergesen is going to be a major league pitcher. He just is too far out of whack right now and all facets of his game to continue running him out there ein my opinion.

Besides, Arrieta is forcing his way into the majors just like Reimold did last year.

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hobbycars AAA

hobbycars

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Here's my question.

After last season (and even during the year) there was some discussion about how Bergesen's peripheral numbers suggested he wouldn't be able to repeat last season's success.

Is it possible the issue isn't whether he can return to last season's form but whether he's just regressing to a more natural level?

Regressing to a beer league softball league pitcher?

Nope-something is wrong.

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