Who knows if this is true or not...

[mcgraw238]

Quick. Name 5 raw toolsy types who haven't been developed.

Quick...Name 5 raw toolsy types who have been developed.

[Sports Guy]

Quick. Name 5 raw toolsy types who haven't been developed.

Pope, Scott and McDonald.

I am not that impressed with Avery although he is showing some improvement in his walk rate. Still have to see on him.

Can't remember if Hudson was supposed to be toolsy or not but he is terrible.

I don't have the drafts from the last several years in front of me but Jordan has made it clear that he likes toolsy, raw athletes...and those guys don't get developed by the Orioles.

[Sports Guy]

Quick...Name 5 raw toolsy types who have been developed.

I asked him this before and he dodged the question.

Hell, name ONE guy?

[Stotle]

This is old news. I've talked about this rift before and most of it was cleared up when David Stockstill moved to another position. But clearly, Jordan feels better about drafting raw but projectable pitchers than he does hitters. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to stop him from drafting guys like Avery, Givens, and Hudson over the last few years when this organization is yet to develop these kinds of guys.

At the same time, I know there are guys showing up into the minor league system with certain "numbers" from scouting reports and are not these guys when evaluated. Guys who will "stick at short" or guys who can do "x" end up not being those guys.

I've gotten a lot of reports on guys and when I see them I'm like, "Huh?" Unfortunately, those are the same reaction as some of the player development guys as well.

There are cracks in the armor everywhere.

I know we've discussed the bolded before -- just can't believe the same issues are still in existence. The larger showcases I go too cover anywhere from 6 - 14 fields. There is no way to see and note everyone in attendance. I will say that some organizations seem to be EVERYWHERE (Toronto comes to mind) and I will say that I've never had the feeling that Baltimore was everywhere at a showcase. Not passing judgment -- as I said, there's too much ground to cover to start making definitive statements about teams' presence -- but Baltimore is certainly not one of the organizations I tend to run into.

FYI, off the top of my head, the guys I see the most (at games, tournaments and showcases) tend to be:

LAA, COL, TOR, BOS, FLA, KAN

[Stotle]

Pope, Scott and McDonald.

I am not that impressed with Avery although he is showing some improvement in his walk rate. Still have to see on him.

Can't remember if Hudson was supposed to be toolsy or not but he is terrible.

I don't have the drafts from the last several years in front of me but Jordan has made it clear that he likes toolsy, raw athletes...and those guys don't get developed by the Orioles.

Hudson was certainly fast, athletic and unrefined at draft time, 2008.

[waroriole]

I know we've discussed the bolded before -- just can't believe the same issues are still in existence. The larger showcases I go too cover anywhere from 6 - 14 fields. There is no way to see and note everyone in attendance. I will say that some organizations seem to be EVERYWHERE (Toronto comes to mind) and I will say that I've never had the feeling that Baltimore was everywhere at a showcase. Not passing judgment -- as I said, there's too much ground to cover to start making definitive statements about teams' presence -- but Baltimore is certainly not one of the organizations I tend to run into.

FYI, off the top of my head, the guys I see the most (at games, tournaments and showcases) tend to be:

LAA, COL, TOR, BOS, FLA, KAN

Forgive me if this is too personal of a question, but how do you have time to be an attorney and a scout?

[JTrea81]

Quick. Name 5 raw toolsy types who haven't been developed.

Tripper Johnson

Tyler Henson

Billy Rowell

Tyler Kolodny

Dustin Yount

To name a few...

Pope would have made that list had it not been for this season. He might still have a chance...

[mcgraw238]

I don't have the drafts from the last several years in front of me but Jordan has made it clear that he likes toolsy, raw athletes...and those guys don't get developed by the Orioles.

But wasn't Tony suggesting in the earlier post that the development side is saying the kids are coming in with certain grades that development is not seeing. A sentiment that Tony seemed to be echoing.

[Moose Milligan]

Tony..you need to take a page from my book...When someone gets under my skin, I never ever respond to them. Just do what i do and you will be fine.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaat is going on here with you lately, SG? Showing a sense of humor, cracking jokes, got an avatar, throwing in smileys wherever you can? I'm likin the changes dude.

[mcgraw238]

Tripper Johnson

Tyler Henson

Billy Rowell

Tyler Kolodny

Dustin Yount

To name a few...

Pope would have made that list had it not been for this season. He might still have a chance...

Well done.

[Tony-OH]

Quick. Name 5 raw toolsy types who haven't been developed.

Rowell

Henson

Pope

Adams

Hudson

[Sports Guy]

Hudson was certainly fast, athletic and unrefined at draft time, 2008.

I thought so but didn't want to represent it as a 100% argument either.

I don't have a lot of hopes for Givens either but at least he is very young, so we will see.

[waroriole]

Rowell

Henson

Pope

Adams

Hudson

Is Rowell a development or scouting blunder? From what I've read he has (and never had) no bat speed.

[Sports Guy]

Lorenzo Scott was not a high draft pick.

McDonald was not raw. He was potentially the #1 pick in the draft. He certainly hasn't developed any better since leaving the organization either.

You can make a case on Pope.

Hudson was toolsy in that he has plus, plus speed. I wouldn't cal him raw but whatever. It's still way too early to draw conclusions on him but I'm not impressed with him.

McDonald was raw...He had a football scholarship...They talked about his athletic talents and that he needed to be molded more into a baseball player.

He was never a baseball player first with great ability..He was a guy with great ability that had to be molded.

[Tony-OH]

Is Rowell a development or scouting blunder? From what I've read he has (and never had) no bat speed.

I don't think bat speed is Rowell's problem. I've seen the ball jump off his bat in BP, and that is usually bat speed. Rowell also had a plus arm. The problems? He wasn't nearly as athletic as advertised, can't pick up off speed pitches, and he ended up being a guy who enjoyed his status, fame and the money that came it a lot more than being a major league baseball player.

You hard to be too hard on scouting because most other teams reportedly had Rowell high on their lists. For me though, I would shy away from high school hitters in the first round unless they are really very, very special. Just too much can go wrong.

A lot went wrong with Rowell but he certainly had tools.