Impressions from the B Team - Red Sox game

[markdublya]

Holy crap Frobby, get out of my head.

The only slight disagreement I have is with Bell. I agree that he looks like a completely different player, but that's exactly why I would send him down to Norfolk to play everyday. I don't see him getting enough at bats to keep him on the big league roster unless Lee can't answer the bell.

This...

I can't put Bell or Reimold on the bench if they aren't starting 4+ games per week. Use their options and let them continue to develop playing every day.

[Shopay]

I can't argue most of your points.

I hope Winn doesn't take a spot in Norfolk, he looks done.

Mahoney is intriguing..looked way behind on first pitch fastball on his last PA..hung in well on the curve, thought pitcher should have done another fastball....I wouldn't call him a smooth runner, not pretty to watch, but gets from A to B at decent speed.

I am not an Andino fan, bad fielding habits, an error machine IMO.

Liked Angle....didn't look fragile to me at all...

Now the NESN announcers, guess it was Remy and someone...were embarassing to MLB and themselves...

I have to respectfully disagree on Mahoney. For a guy 6'7" and 255 lbs, I thought he looked pretty smooth/athletic. He moved pretty well. A lot of guys his size would have simply pulled up for the 2 bagger. I was impressed.

[UpstateNYfan]

I have to respectfully disagree on Mahoney. For a guy 6'7" and 255 lbs, I thought he looked pretty smooth/athletic. He moved pretty well. A lot of guys his size would have simply pulled up for the 2 bagger. I was impressed.

I was impressed with going for three also. I did say he gets from A to B with decent speed....just didn't get style points from me...even on his tag...not complaining

[Frobby]

Holy crap Frobby, get out of my head.

Seriously, I was going to put something together like this today but you hit most of what I wanted to talk about. The only slight disagreement I have is with Bell. I agree that he looks like a completely different player, but that's exactly why I would send him down to Norfolk to play everyday. I don't see him getting enough at bats to keep him on the big league roster unless Lee can't answer the bell....

I disagree with you on Angle though. I think he's does a lot of the little things well and he's not a guy that's going to impress you with one look. I can see him carving out a nice 4th outfielder spot eventually and in the right situation might end up as someone starter in CF. He's a much better player all around than Fiorentino, although Fio brought more pop. Angle looked a bit overmatched by Buchholz and Jenks, and that's a concern since the one knock against him offensively (besides the lack of power) is the concerns that he can be overmatched by good fastballs. I think he can end up better than a AAAA guy though.

One guy I did kind of like was left-hander Mike Ballard. He reminds me of Troy Patton but with a better slider. Not sure he's much more than a long guy, but there's some potential for some depth at Norfolk. He looks like he has the potential to be tough against lefties as well. Not a ton of fastball, but he might be worth keeping an eye on this year at Norfolk.

I agree with most of these points, although I'm not ready to give up on Pelzer yet.

Mahoney really impresses me with his athleticism for someone his size. He can run and apparently jump (per prior post on team verticals). I love how in hung in on curve from lefthander to triple. Smooth looking player. I like what what I'm seeing from Bell as well. He's clearly progressed from last year and weight loss has to have helped.

Harris is not an RBI guys. Unfortunately for him is competing with two RBI guys, Bell and Reimold, for the 25th man spot and the RBI guys are likely to win.

Mahoney is #3. The way Mahoney is playing this spring combined with what he did last year makes him the O's third best minor league prospect behind Britton and Machado. He is that guy that should have been somewhere between 75 and 100 on the top 100 prospects. He is hitting right now against major league and AAA pitchers and doing it well. He needs to flash a little more power with that speed but with his build and what he did last year it sure be something that develops.

I look for Andino to get trade last in ST. He shows enough that he probably should be backing up someones infield but it is unlikely to happen in Baltimore because of Izzy. He is out for option and as been outrighted once so he can refuse a minor league assignment this year. He is showing enough that some scout may be looking for an infielder and recommend him. The trade will not bring much back but he may not make it through waivers.

Pelzer most likely becomes nothing because of poor command. However, he's got a lot of movement on his fastball. I'm guessing he threw some two seamers that really dove done and his slider is a good one. The velocity is certainly down from what has been written in some reports (BA).

Agree with you for the most part. However, I think the Wynn Pelzer judgement is a little premature. Sure, he had a bad inning...it happens. Do you remember when Cesar Izturis hit a bomb off Cliff Lee? All i'm saying is don't disqualify a guy based on one appearance.

On Angle: Tony, you have had the advantage of seeing him play at other times. My impressions were solely from this game. I do expect him to be a better fielder and faster baserunner than Fio. He's probably not as good a hitter.

On Ballard: I agree he looked good. I'd never even heard of him.

On Mahoney: The pitch he hit for a triple was a pretty poor hanging curve ball. It's good that he could hit a curve off a left pitcher, but the pitch stunk. I like what I saw from him but I think wildcard has hitched his wagon to this guy last fall and is now going to overreact to anything good that he does.

On Pelzer: I agree you can't judge a guy off one outing, but I just have a gut feeling on this one. I didn't like his demeanor on the mound -- after he got behind the first hitter his body language told you that he felt like he was in big trouble. I'll be glad to admit if if my snap judgment turns out wrong.

On Harris: I don't care if he is an "RBI guy," runner on 3rd and less than 2 out you have to do better than he did.

[Hooded Viper]

This...

I can't put Bell or Reimold on the bench if they aren't starting 4+ games per week. Use their options and let them continue to develop playing every day.

I agree. Young players with potential shouldn't be bench players until they have proven that they are nothing more than bench players. I send them both to AAA unless they will get steady at bats each week, which I doubt.

[wildcard]

On Angle: Tony, you have had the advantage of seeing him play at other times. My impressions were solely from this game. I do expect him to be a better fielder and faster baserunner than Fio. He's probably not as good a hitter.

On Ballard: I agree he looked good. I'd never even heard of him.

On Mahoney: The pitch he hit for a triple was a pretty poor hanging curve ball. It's good that he could hit a curve off a left pitcher, but the pitch stunk. I like what I saw from him but I think wildcard has hitched his wagon to this guy last fall and is now going to overreact to anything good that he does.

On Pelzer: I agree you can't judge a guy off one outing, but I just have a gut feeling on this one. I didn't like his demeanor on the mound -- after he got behind the first hitter his body language told you that he felt like he was in big trouble. I'll be glad to admit if if my snap judgment turns out wrong.

On Harris: I don't care if he is an "RBI guy," runner on 3rd and less than 2 out you have to do better than he did.

OK, with the information you have right now. Not the information he had last fall. Who is a better O's prospect then Mahoney? Avery? Hoes? A guy that can hit for power and average like Mahoney is going to be a better prospect then a speed guy. He is just a more rounded player.

Am I bias? Probably. But even with that I'd like you to tell me who is a better prospect knowing what we know now.

[wildcard]

This...

I can't put Bell or Reimold on the bench if they aren't starting 4+ games per week. Use their options and let them continue to develop playing every day.

Reimold is 27 with a better part of a year in the majors already. If he can hit major league pitching and is a decent fielder it is time for him to be in the majors. The only reason that shouldn't happen is if they can't fit him on the roster IMO.

[MikeAD]

Putting aside the fact that you hate Pie (as a player) and will go to great lengths to mention anything that he does that is negative, I have to agree that it annoyed me no end that he swung at that 3-0 pitch. I meant to mention that in the OP.

As big of a fan as I am of Pie, you are right. Making choices like that at the plate is something you can't have in the lineup six out of seven games. If he just does that once a game and hes playing 1-3 times a week, he will succeed enough to make it passable.

Reimold has the option, so Pie will be on the team. The problem is, for Pie's trade value to go up, he needs to play. Hes got to be out there on the field. I don't see that happening unless Jones gets hurt. Then if he fills in and performs extremely well you might be able to get a decent return. Other than that, he will likely be the fourth outfielder next year, getting many starts in LF when Reimold DH's. I will take it though, it could be a lot worse.

[flashjordnk]

I agree. Young players with potential shouldn't be bench players until they have proven that they are nothing more than bench players. I send them both to AAA unless they will get steady at bats each week, which I doubt.

People realize that Reimold is actually a few months older than Reynolds right? Is the question really about him developing or proving last year was behind him?

If Buck thinks last year is behind him, his track record shows a lot of similarity to Reynolds. A decent eye, good power, mediocre defense.

The only reason to send Reimold down IMO is if you actually have questions about his bounce back.

[Singleton]

I watched a lot of last night's game, and came away with the following:

1. Josh Bell looks like a completely different player, both in terms of physical appearance and his approach at the plate. I think he could be in the conversation for a bench spot.

2. Fox raked another double, and seemed to catch a good game. Right now I think he beats out Tatum for backup C.

3. Randy Winn looks DONE.

4. I really like Brandon Snyder's swing and his set-up at the plate. He's got to go back to Norfold, and I see Bell as a big obstacle to Snyder now that Bell is taking some turns at 1B. But, I still hold out hope for Snyder.

5. Brendan Harris had two opportunities with a runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs. First time he hit a weak grounder directly at the SS, second time a weak pop-up to 1B. Fail.

6. Joe Mahoney looks the part of a major league player. He definitely showed good speed for a big man, almost beating out a high chopper to 2B, and later getting a triple on a hit in the gap. He didn't look overmatched at the plate. I'm not saying he'll be a major leaguer, but he looks like one.

7. Wynn Pelzer is in the Radhames Liz category. Pass.

8. Andino had a pretty good game in the field, turning a very difficult DP and fielding a bad hop chopper to his right and gunning the throw for the out. He has good skills defensively, though his style is a bit unorthodox.

9. Matt Angle is pretty fragile looking, but he made a nice catch in foul territory while playing RF, and hit a nice sac fly when he came up with a Mahoney on 3rd and one out. For me, he's in the Jeff Fiorentino mold -- a guy who won't hold a major league job for a full season, but who can come up to replace an injured player and not embarass himself.

I didn't catch the game last night so can't comment on the particulars here but one thing does stand out to me.

I'm sure you are right that B. Harris had a couple of lousy at bats but we're talking about a 30 year old player with 1600 MLB at bats.

I'm not going to "fail" him because of two abs in a B game during spring training.

He's a known commodity. He's not a great player. He's not even a good player but he can serve a purpose at the end of a bench filling in on rare occassions when needed.

The idea -- as proposed elsewhere in this thread -- that it makes more sense to keep Reimold or Bell as the 25th man -- where they will mostly sit and watch is ridiculous.

Unless they are going to play regularly -- and without injuries or trades they will not -- they need to be in Norfolk's every day line up and demonstrate they they can rip it up. They didn't last year -- though i have plenty of hope.

[Frobby]

OK, with the information you have right now. Not the information he had last fall. Who is a better O's prospect then Mahoney? Avery? Hoes? A guy that can hit for power and average like Mahoney is going to be a better prospect then a speed guy. He is just a more rounded player.

Am I bias? Probably. But even with that I'd like you to tell me who is a better prospect knowing what we know now.

I don't pretend to have independent views here. Last night was the first time I've ever seen Mahoney play, and I've never seen most of the guys in the Orioles' system play. So, any opinion I have is necessarily derivative of what I've read elsewhere, and/or influenced by looking at the player's stats.

Here's what I know: Mahoney is not on the top 10 lists of Orioles Hangout (16th), Baseball America, Baseball Prospectus (not in top 20), or minorleague ball.com (John Sickels, who ranks him 11th). He did very little at all before last year. Last year, his AA stats were largely driven by a super-heated 2 week period. He's not a young guy (24) and hasn't played AAA yet, in fact he started last year in Frederick.

So, to answer your question, it seems there are a lot of Orioles prospects who are considered better than Mahoney.

Now, does that mean I am pegging Mahoney to definitely fail? No, not by a longshot. Was Brad Bergesen ever on anyone's top 10 list? No, but he proved he could be an effective major league pitcher. He has turned out better than most players who were ranked ahead of him.

Let's just say Mahoney still has a lot to prove before he starts showing up high on the list.

[Arthur_Bryant]

With Bell, Mahoney, Snyder and Angle in the starting lineup last night, I was nearly as interested to watch this game as I was to see Britton the other night. ST is great for these first looks, and I wish I could see 100 PA from all these guys.

No conclusions on any of this but...

Bell looks like a real ballplayer, the guy we were hoping to see when he showed up last summer. He has apparently been having solid ABs all spring. I think Presley or someone is working with him: he looks like a hitter in the midst of a hitting revamp. I wrote in another thread that he seems to be making an effort to wait on the pitch and then go with it where it is pitched--a much different approach than I saw last year. He didn't swing at a ball off the plate last night, and laid off a couple of marginal pitches. His swing was compact and balanced. I don't think he will get a utility spot out of ST, and I don't think he should. But I believe that he could handle it if it happened.

Mahoney definitely bears watching. I have a question about his raw bat speed, but we'll see. The foot speed is for real. He nearly beat out a routine grounder to SS last night. He probably deserves to be in Norfolk soon.

I hope Brandon Snyder gets a chance to play every day. I still think this guy can hit. His approach and his mechanics are big league quality.

As noted above, Angle didn't handle the quality fast balls last night, though on the first K by Buchholz I think he was looking for something offspeed.

And Felix Pie... I have been a big proponent, and the tools are there, but he just doesn't seem to put things together. Little things... Last night he ran a long way to catch a fly ball that Angle was camped under in RF. He just seems to be a half-beat off the music that everybody else is playing.

[waroriole]

For me the things that are mentioned here is why Pie is probably not a regular outfielder and is more of 4th OF. It is why if Angle has a good first half at Norfolk, Pie could be traded at the deadline. However, Angle is not ready yet and Pie is needed on this team to backup CF.

I'm not ready to give up on Pie just yet, and I doubt that if we traded him around the deadline we'd get anything back (especially if he just sits on our bench). However, I do agree that Angle will be a very useful 4th OF for us very soon.

[Sports Guy]

I have to respectfully disagree on Mahoney. For a guy 6'7" and 255 lbs, I thought he looked pretty smooth/athletic. He moved pretty well. A lot of guys his size would have simply pulled up for the 2 bagger. I was impressed.

Yep...Now if he could just hit, we may have a prospect on our hands!

[waroriole]

OK, with the information you have right now. Not the information he had last fall. Who is a better O's prospect then Mahoney? Avery? Hoes? A guy that can hit for power and average like Mahoney is going to be a better prospect then a speed guy. He is just a more rounded player.

Am I bias? Probably. But even with that I'd like you to tell me who is a better prospect knowing what we know now.

Hoes, and it's not particularly close, IMO.